A graphic of lost of different sentimental paperwork
Episode 361 – Decluttering for yourself – why Swedish death cleaning might not be for you

In this episode, we dive into Swedish Death Cleaning. Despite its dramatic name, it’s a gentle, reflective approach to decluttering that helps reduce the burden on loved ones after we’re gone.

We also touch on finding your own rhythm with decluttering methods—from the KonMari method to our own to Reset Your Home System—and the power of community in helping you succeed.

Ultimately, Swedish Death Cleaning teaches us to lighten the load for others—but the real transformation happens when we lighten it for ourselves.
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Transcript of this podcast episode
Speaker 1  00:00
In this episode, we dive into Swedish death cleaning, despite its dramatic name, it's a gentle, reflective approach to decluttering that helps reduce the burden on loved ones after we're gone. We also touch on finding your own rhythm with decluttering methods, from the Konmari method to our own reset your home system and the power of community in helping you succeed. Ultimately, Swedish death cleaning teaches us to lighten the load for others, but the real transformation happens when we lighten it for ourselves. You

Speaker 2  00:45
You're listening to the declutter hub podcast, bringing you tried and tested no nonsense tips and advice from the leading experts in decluttering and organising your home. Now here are your hosts Ingrid Jansen and Lesley Spellman. 


Speaker 1  01:08
Hello and welcome listeners. I'm Ingrid and I'm Lesley. If you're new to the declutter hub podcast, you're so welcome. What you'll find is that we try and find a fun factor in the serious business of decluttering, and if you've been here for a while, you know exactly what we mean. So thank you so much for listening.

Speaker 3  01:28
If you'd like to get involved in conversations relating to this podcast, it all takes place in our Facebook group. So come and join our lovely, warm, supportive community. To find the Facebook group, go to declutter hub.com, forward slash group to find out more, or you can search for the declutter hub community on Facebook. Well,

Speaker 1  01:47
hello and welcome listeners. We are going to talk about Swedish death cleaning, and it does sound a bit dramatic, doesn't it? Lesley, Swedish death cleaning, because people immediately think that it's about death, but actually it's about living, isn't it, which is actually quite a contradictory in terms, but yeah, it's interesting. Yeah, it's

Speaker 3  02:08
interesting. And people might wonder why we're talking about it right now, because the book, I think, came out in like, 2017 2018 something like that. So Margaret Magnusson, a Swedish lady, wrote this book while she was going through her own experience. Experiences of clearing her house, and it was a worldwide success, basically, and there's a TV show and all of those things. And it's a fabulous, fantastic book that loads of people absolutely love, but it seems to have had a bit of a regeneration, doesn't it, in the last sort of six months or so, and lots of people have been talking about it. You guys all know that since our book came out, we've had lots and lots of press, and so we keep getting asked for our opinions on Swedish desk cleaning. And so we thought, let's have a little chat about it on the podcast, because we do stand behind it. But of course, as always, we have some things to say as well.

Speaker 1  03:04
Of course we do. Of course we do. And let's start with the Swedish term. And I do not speak Swedish, but I do.

Speaker 3  03:13
Okay. Do you want to know why Swedish o level in my lunch hour when I was 16? I've told you this before, of course, and I literally can't say single words. I wouldn't even know how you'd say that, but I'm gonna give it a go with me being an English Swedish speaker at all. I think it's like der steading.

Speaker 1  03:31
Yes, I would say also Dutch steading, or something like that. I mean, I'm not Swedish, but, of course, I come from Holland, so it's the I'm not afraid by all the United Yeah, it's like,

Speaker 3  03:44
it's literally got nothing to do with Holland. It's the same as me saying I'm English. Like it's my No.

Speaker 1  03:53
But what I'm saying, I'm trying to say that I probably can pronounce it, maybe because I'm not afraid of the kind of funny little dots and stuff that's on the word, because people might go, I don't even know how to pronounce it, but I'm happy to give it a go. I think it's Dutch standing.

Speaker 3  04:07
Okay, well, I can't remember how to say it, but can we've got, we've got a Swedish member, so we should have asked Camilla, shouldn't we, anyway, right? Okay, so that's the name. That's the term for Swedish death cleaning, or death cleaning, actually. And really, what it's all about is the act of decluttering your belongings as you start to get older, so that your loved ones are then not burdened with that clutter after you are gone. So it's about sort of pre empting what is inevitably going to come, which is that you are going to pass away and not having all of your stuff left behind. So somebody is like, what do we do with this stuff? What's important in this stuff? Where is the important stuff? Where are the memories? What should I keep? What should I let go? When am I doing a disservice to my late more, more. A dad, or whoever that is. So it's all about trying to do that process before the inevitable happens. And so passing that legacy on and and also, of course, passing a legacy on to those you leave behind,

Speaker 1  05:17
yes, and I think a lot of people, because it's called Death cleaning. Think it's about death, but, like I said before, but actually it's not. It's really about how do you when you're still you know? Well, I mean, I'm 50, my 51 myself in your prime of life. Did you kind of go through the things and go actually, I've gathered all this stuff along the way. What do I want to take forward in my life? And how can I prevent all this stuff cluttering up the cupboards, and indeed, not leaving all this stuff behind for other people? Because I think we sometimes you get the feeling that people, on one hand, know they're going to die at some point, but on the other hand, don't want to acknowledge this fact. So kind of thing they can keep on living the way they are. We see it a lot with with older people, right? They they really want to try and keep living in their own house, in their own rooms. And we, we, we, I think we all think we can stay in our own houses forever, but I think we have to be realistic. And we all get a lot older these days than a couple of generations ago, and I think we have to be realistic. Does that house fit with us and our health and our mobility and our safety and all of these things, but by clinging on to the stuff, I think sometimes we just think, well, we're happy here, and we have everything what we need, and we've got everything around us that we love, but it can really prevent you also from seeing the other possibilities when you grow older in life. I think,

Speaker 3  06:48
yeah, I think it really, you know, it's about, I think stuff is always a comfort. Whatever age you are in life, stuff can provide a comfort to a lot of people, and seeing that stuff around you is comforting. And I think that's the thing that people sort of cling on to, and we don't want to kind of upset the apple cart a little bit, but I think let's talk about Swedish decline a little bit more and break down what the key principles are in the book. Now this is a long book with a lot of nuance in it, but the basics of the book are that it's about being responsible. It's not about morbidity, so it's not about death. It's about responsibility while you are living it is going to encourage reflection. So why are we holding on to things unnecessarily in some instances? And I think the big idea is that this is your legacy. This is your gift to the people that you leave behind, both from a practical perspective and from an emotional perspective as well. Really, by storytelling. You know, we've spoken about this many, many times Ingrid, haven't we? That we love the idea of sharing stories and sharing the story behind the stuff before you've passed away, so that that legacy for the important things in life that do deserve a sort of Second Life after you've gone, can can remain, and people understand why that's such an important part and to keep within a family. And I think, you know, it's fair to say, even though it's Swedish desk cleaning, the key principles within the book do say this is not just something you need to do when you're old. This is something that you can start a midlife that's the kind of you know, we we are firmly planted in midlife at the moment Ingrid. So the idea is, this is something that you can start in your wherever you consider midlife to be. She always listened to her podcast, which is called, like, the midpoint, or something, um, with Gabby Logan. And she midlife, to her is like 36 what it starts at like 3036 I'm like, What do you mean? What do you mean it starts at 36 that's still youthful, right? So, yeah, just wanted to throw that in that's always been quite shocking when she shares what she considers midlife to be

Speaker 1  09:01
Wow. I know I that's a bit younger. I wasn't I was not ready to be in midlife when I was 36 I'll tell you that Lesley, I know I might be 51 now, but I'm still in my head. I'm like 39

Speaker 3  09:19
I know, are we all? Aren't we all? So yeah, so those are the key principles, really, that sit within the Swedish death cleaning book. Loads of people of you will have it, you will have read it, you will have loved it, you might have watched the TV show as well. So a lot of people will understand the key principles of that. And we wanted to talk about some of the the practical, what the practical aspects of the book as well Ingrid, yes,

Speaker 1  09:41
they also start with the easy stuff, which is, I think, really nice because, I mean, we've got, of course, in our principle that we start with easier rooms, but they also say you need to start with easier stuff. So don't start with the photographs and the letters, because they're really hard to make decisions upon, I think, as well as part of Swedish. Death cleaning, a big part is talking to your family, right? It's not only you doing the process, it is getting your family involved and asking them questions and what means something for you and what's important for me, and sharing that, I think they do a lot of labeling as well to make things much clearer, which I we love, of course, we love labels, but maybe not only on on shelves or on drawers or on on boxes, but I think it's also labeling the the different categories of paperwork and admin and that kind of thing to kind of, you know, get more organised and not find a whole home office full of, you know, 30 years of paperwork, but really kind of go through all that stuff, and what do we need for the now? And it's really all about, you know, finding out and keeping what matters and letting go of the stuff that weighs you down. So of course, you know, a lot of these principles we love and we completely agree with, I

Speaker 3  11:02
can feel a book coming now Ingrid, I can definitely feel a book coming. So why are we talking about Swedish death clean and the principles in that when we indeed have our own methodology? And I think, you know, one of the big things really, that that we sort of struggle with when it comes to Swedish, Swedish death cleaning, is that, because of what it sort of purveys really, with this idea of starting in midlife, we're like, why? Like, why are we going to use a decluttering methodology that is about somebody else, really, when we need to re shift that focus back onto ourselves? Now, of course, by going through the Swedish death cleaning process, it allows an opportunity for self reflection. So ultimately, is for ourselves. But I think we also there's a real shift. We need to shift that focus and go Swedish death cleaning can come later or not at all, because if we get into a habit of decluttering from eight, 910, years old, which is what we would be advocates of, and constantly having decluttering as part of your life, then you're not going to need to do sweet Swedish death cleaning, because by the time you're 20 or 30 years old, you're fully going to understand the importance of the stuff that you have around you and how it needs to serve your current life, which is what it's all about. Ultimately, the principles are very similar. So we want to go to a break now. We're going to come back and going to talk about methodologies and why we we sort of latch on to different ones, and which ones work, and why they work, and things like that. So we're going to go to a quick break. I'm going to come back in a moment.

Speaker 1  12:43
Hi everyone. Welcome back after your break. So before the break, we talked about Swedish death cleaning and that it really says, you know, you're doing this because you want, don't want to leave clutter and stuff for other people, but we're saying Lesley and I, we think it's really important that you declutter for yourself, and of course, that will benefit other people. But we really want you to say, Okay, I'm doing this decluttering because I want to live in a home that I love and that I feel good in, that I feel safe in, and that I feel happy in. And I'm doing this for me because space and calm and energy and a good mindset are fantastic things to want for yourself, and I think you will really benefit from that. So we love decluttering to be focused around you. But of course, everybody is always so focused on other people that we forget that self care, right? That's that decluttering actually is caring for yourself and making, you, know, doing your future self a favor and making the most out of your home and your life and the items that around you now,

Speaker 3  13:51
absolutely nothing. You know, it's really interesting from from time to time on socials or when we're doing challenges and things like that, we ask people why they want to declutter, because sometimes it's important to go back to that kind of big picture goal that we talk about quite a lot in the declutter hub. And you know, quite often it is about other people. So it is, I don't want to leave this stuff behind for my family, for my children, and that's a really, really important point. Don't get me wrong. That's a really, really important thing. But as well as that, we want you to do it for you. That's more important in a lot of ways. You know, whoever's left behind will sort it out, and it'll be a bit of an inconvenience, but ultimately, they won't carry that burden of stuff for their entire lives. And so it's really important for you to do it for you. So that's the kind of the message and why we would slightly we think there's a slight change, shift in focus, really, from what we teach then, and what Swedish death cleaning houses at its core. And I'm sure, if you read the whole of the Swedish death cleaning book, that will also be within that as well. For sure, do you know to me? Mean, but I think sometimes we just take the headline, don't we? We just take the headline. So, you know, just to to reiterate what Ingrid said, you know, we really want to gain that clarity, that peace, that current life, you know, really being proud of ourselves and what we've done, and having the stuff that reflects the current US, and also, you know, something that serves you now and doesn't store your past. You know, it's really important that we keep things. You know, quite often we kind of keep things from the past and for the future. We're always looking over people within this within this decluttering journey. We know we're keeping things from the past that we have inherited and things like that. We're keeping things for the future, for our loved ones. You know, we're keeping all you know, that table will come in really useful for my son when he moves out, or whatever that might be. And so we, we fall foul of Not, not seeing the middle bit, the now bit, we're going focusing too much on the past and the future. So really, really think about whether or not that's you, but ultimately, by going through any decluttering process with any methodology, and we say this, you know, hand on heart, if a decluttering methodology resonates with you, then that's the one that you need to cling to. It's really, really important. And so there are so many ways that you can declutter out there, but if you find one that works, then go for it, and that moves you forward, because it's going to make you feel freer. It's going to make you feel more in control, and in some ways, more aligned with your values and what you want to do with like that's what this is all about. You know? It's all about finding time for you to do the things that you love without being burdened by the stuff and the chores that sit there at home for you. Yeah,

Speaker 1  16:47
you got the soapbox out there, Lesley. I was like, I was like, yeah.

Speaker 3  16:51
But because I do feel, you know, I think it's important sometimes to go, why? Like, yeah. Because we just see Ingrid how important that is to people, really, really important to kind of, you know, to see what it represents for people. And we, we're lucky, right? Because we see with our clients, we see the kind of wake off people's shoulders with our members who have been sort of stuck in drudgery for a long time, which is what it what it feels like, this burden on your shoulders all the time, and then you come out and kind of see the light, and you're like, oh, there's a whole life out here waiting for me that I've, like, held in a box because I've been surrounded by stuff for all this time. And actually, now I can start living a little bit more like I want to, and that's what it's all about. It's not about getting rid of stuff. It's about living the life that you want to lead anyway, kind of kind of connected, but not connected. So yeah, let's talk about what we're here to talk about. And let me start getting all who, gosh, yeah. And so we want to talk about methodologies. And within this, we're going to look at our own methodology, and we're going to look at Swedish death cleaning a little bit more. And Marie condos methodology, the Commer method, which is probably the one that most people are familiar with. And so honestly, when we say this, there are so many that, you know they talk about. There's so many different ways to do things right, and it's important to find one that works for you? Yeah. You know, it's really interesting. You know, this week, isn't it? Ingrid, because we, we, we've had a lot of new members after the clear right close challenge a couple of months ago, and people are starting to get into the into our process and things like that. And always, so, so lovely, isn't it to see on the forum what people are saying. And we had one this week, didn't we? Ingrid? So do you want to read out what she said? Because I think we remembered it when we were prepping for this podcast. Didn't all that thing that lady said this week, and it's just exactly what we want to say?

Speaker 1  18:50
Yeah, exactly because she said so she joined indeed after, after our recent challenge, she said, I have to say, I've attempted the cluttering before many times, but never got far. This feels different. It seems like everything is in place to succeed. So she came into our membership. She's starting to take the next steps, right? So in the challenge, we try, we talk about lots of different things. But of course, in a three day challenge, you can't explain the whole reset your home system and all the things that Lesley and I feel about decluttering and organising and why it's so important to understand your emotions before you start thinking about your decluttering, all the practical things that need to happen. And she's really said, I've attempted all these different methods, these different ways of decluttering before, but she never, she got stuck all the time, and she said this time, it feels different. So this new member has founded our way, our research, your home system really, really works for you. And everything that we have within the declutter of membership is there. Her to succeed. And and Lesley then answered, and which I thought was so lovely, as well, as she said, I'm so happy to see everything is falling into place for you. Finding the right place and the right people to help you is half the battle. And I think that really, you know, I loved, I loved reading that post from both, from both the member and from Lesley, because I think it really shows the importance of you need to find something that works for you to make it stick. And it's the process, it's the practicality, it's the way we teach. It's Our Community of wonderful other members that we have that really understand how, how our way has helped them to succeed as well. And we know that a lot of people struggle, feel really overwhelmed with clutter, and who struggle with clutter, our way of teaching really helps them because, you know, with we've worked as professional organisers in people's homes for, for gosh, since, for 15 years, Lesley and I, we know on the ground how it is and how it feels and what people see. So of course, a lot of the books out there that you see are people's own experience, right? So Margareta, who wrote Swedish debt cleaning, probably just thought, Okay, I'm gonna write the process, because I'm gonna go through it. So she wrote from her own experience. She's written everything down. Marie Kondo wanted you know was struggling with clot and tried to find her way through it, and she did that by pulling everything out and going through it and deciding what made her happy, what sparked joy. But Lesley and I look at it from a different perspective, because of having worked with so many different people, we know it's not about the stuff, but it's about the emotions that sit behind this stuff.

Speaker 3  22:00
I think, you know, I think it's important, you know, to so we have our methodology. Margaret Magnusson has her methodology. Marie Kondo has her methodology. And there are probably 50 or 60 other important, valuable, successful decluttering methodologies out there, some of which some of you may have tried, which may have worked, some have not worked for whatever reason. And I think really, what we wanted to say is every methodology, as English said, is born out of somebody's personal experience. Ours is born out of lots of people's experiences, because we, you know, because we've got lots of clients and members and all that kind of stuff. And Marie Kondo, you know, Margaret, is born out of their individual experiences. But what you need to do this is about you looking at that and going, which parts of this resonate with me, and how can I look at that, take the core methodology and then fit it into what I want to achieve in my home? So you can't. So sometimes the reason why people go, I've tried so many different things. It just doesn't, doesn't work. It's because it's not either you're not going, Oh, actually, so say, for for example. And this is, this is hard to say, because do I think that everything within the Swedish desk cleaning or Marie Kondo is black and white? No, of course, it's not so Marie condos core methodology is to try and pull, you know, the highlights of what she's saying. I'm sure it's very nuanced inside, and there will be things in there that says you don't have to do that. You don't think about it. Does that work for you and all that. But ultimately, we live our life on headlines. That's the problem. We take these headlines and we run with them. So the real skill for you, then, as somebody that's overwhelmed with clutter, is taking those headlines and going, is that going to work for me? And how can I change it up slightly so that it will work? So where Marie Kondo says, get all your clothes out at once, look at that and go, actually something's going to work, because I've got to sleep tonight. I've got seven wardrobes I've got so I hear what she's saying, and I do want that process, because that's almost like you're confronting your own behavior. And we have a part of that in our own membership, with our counts and confess and so well, in our challenges, not our membership, actually. And so it's about you looking at that and going, that's not going to work. I'm going to do this slightly differently. I'm going to employ the idea behind that, but I'm not going to do it exactly, exactly as she says, the same with Swedish death cleaning. You know, you can go, You know what? She's actually said that I'm going to do it in it to start doing that in midlife, or before I get older. Actually, I'm going to start employing those principles that are in there, all of which will be fantastic, because it's about reflection on your stuff ultimately. And I'm going to take that and in our in our methodology, we're very, very emotions based. And so there will be some of that, those emotions that resonate with you and somebody like, you know what? Lesley, I don't have a problem with that emotion. I don't. Problem getting rid of stuff. But actually I'm going to take the structure, I'm going to take the road back, I'm going to take the principles and all that, those kind of things. And so really the job is for you to go. What resonates well with me? If some light bulbs are going on as soon as you really like, Yes, I do want to focus on spark joy or that really sit. It really speaks to me that I don't want to leave my stuff behind for those for my family, or actually, I've never thought about decluttering an emotional way before. And that's really speaking to me. Then that headline is something that's going to hook you in. It's probably going to be the right methodology for you. But then once you get into the methodology, into the system, into the process. You've got to fit that to your home. Everything. We've got our book came out last week in the States. It's been out in the in the UK and for ages and Australia. So it's out there everywhere. Now, you know, there will be things in that book that don't make sense to you, but there will be an awful lot that does. And so it's really important to not just be prescriptive about a process, isn't it, and I think that's why some things don't work. Now, having said that, there are some nonsensical methodologies, like absolute garbage Ingrid, yeah, yes.

Speaker 1  26:21
So because we get, we get asked on a very, very regular basis to contribute to articles and magazines and write pieces. And every once in a while, the something comes up that we're like, look at each other and go, what was that? And we actually had a request, if we wanted to what our thoughts were on the poop method, and we went, excuse me, pardon me. And we actually we had to google right what it was, right. And we did see kind of a meme about it somewhere or some, but it basically is. It's a decluttering technique where you imagine an item covered in poop to help you decide if you should keep it or discard it. And the idea is that if you wouldn't want to clean it and keep something covered in poop, then it's probably not worth keeping in your home. Lesley and I looked at each other and we went, I don't know who has come up with this, but this makes no sense whatsoever, right? Why would somebody think of something like this? I'm confused. I

Speaker 3  27:31
mean, the problem is, like there are so many, as English says, We get asked we did comment on the 1010, 10 method and the 777, method and the and all of those things. You know, we've done a podcast, actually, about a numbers the numbers game, I think, where we talked about things like that a little bit more. And if that works for you, then that's brilliant, just mean. But honestly, the poop rule is just like the world's gone crazy. This that if we have to, if we as sane, grown adults, have to look at decluttering and understanding and reflecting and making decisions on our stuff based on whether or not it is covered potentially in poop, then the world's gone crazy. I'm just walking out the door now, do you know? I mean, that's just crazy. But the problem is that these things gather momentum and people again, look at the headline and go, actually, that makes sense, because, yeah, would I keep that if it was covered in but you can't do your whole house based on whether or not something's got talking about it. But I think we but I suppose what we're trying to say is there's some really solid methodology decluttering methodologies out there. There's some really solid, fantastic teachers. We are not short of getting fantastic decluttering advice from podcasts, books, YouTube channels, memberships, courses, all of that. All fantastic, but the onus is on. You to find out what's going to work for you to look at what what you've done in the past, to look at what's worked, what hasn't worked. What kind of person you are? Are you visual? Do you like to listen? Are you do you go in, you know, all guns blazing? Um, do you want to do it quickly? Do you want to do it slowly? How much clutter Do you have? How long have you had this clutter problem? Or there's not a one size fits all for sure in the decluttering world, but all of these decluttering methodologies, I'm going to say, except the poop rule, have got some substance behind them. That means that they've worked for somebody, and that I know we're going to get people going. I did the poop world thing, and it really works. And I'm like, but it just, yeah, it annoys me, because I just think it belittles so much, yeah, the struggle that people have with clutter, and that annoys me as well. So I'm going to get now. I'm going to get back on the soapbox.

Speaker 1  29:59
I think. Think you know what? Lesley, I think we realize that exactly what you said, there's so much behind decluttering and organising, and people need an understanding, and people need to be honest with themselves as well, you know, and make the time for it. We are so used to doing everything quick, having it now having it. We're in such a fast world, and decluttering is something you can't always do quick. You have to think about things. You have to take things slow. You have to think do things methodically. And you know a method can be as good or as bad as you yourself make it if you think, you can declare to your house that you've not decluttered anything from in 12 years time. If you realistically think that within 12 days you can do a whole house, you need to step back front and go. Does this make sense? It takes time. It takes energy. It takes commitment. It needs, you know, it needs learning. And that's what you know, a lot of people say in a membership, right? I came into this membership wondering why on earth I needed this membership. One of our more recent members, who started, I think, in January, she did a fantastic post in a forum, and she's like, I was really kind of wondering, why on earth do I need a membership? I know that I can put something in a bin bag, but she said, I've learned so much because it's so much more than how do I put something in a bin bag? It's about understanding yourself and looking at your own life and what you can and you cannot do, and how much time you put forward to it. And I think that's why a lot of people who struggle with clutter and the emotions that sit behind the items feel that our methodology is the one that works. But if you're somebody's like, well, you know, I've got a bit of stuff, I'm fine. You know, our methodology probably is not the one for you. But if you've been struggling for a long time with clutter and it's built up and you really feel emotional and overwhelmed about it, then our methodology can really, really, really help you. And it could start with listening to the podcast. You can, you know, buy a book. You can go into our Facebook group, and if you then think, you know what, actually now I'm ready to, you know, dive in and learn so much more, and really, really get going. Then our membership is the place. And I think she really realized that our member, she was like, right, I now know why I needed this membership and why I'm having so much success, because I'm learning to break it down. I'm learning how to manage this on a day to day basis, how to stay on top of things. I'm growing as a person. My mindset is changing and all of the things. And it's fantastic. It's fantastic to see.

Speaker 3  32:43
Very happy. So, yeah, so, so, yeah. So, that's it. So that's our our comments on Swedish death cleaning, fantastic. You know, a fantastic book, um, not as good as our book. Obviously, you haven't bought it yet. You know where it is. Declutter hub, com, forward slash book. And we thought that we would open back up our $1 trial as well, because a lot of people are like, getting to that kind of slump stage in the year. A lot of people have got a little bit of time off with their kids over the summer, and may want to kind of introduce a little bit of decluttering into the schedule with your children as well. Don't think because your children are off school, that you can't do decluttering. This is the time to start to get them involved. So we wanted to put our you know, our trial comes. Every now and again, we open up an offer for a trial. So you can get 14 days for $1 or one pound, and so you can come in and see what the declutter membership is all about, and whether or not it is something that's going to work for you. And so, yeah, it's really important. And the one thing that I want to say really about our membership is you do get access to Ingrid. And I that, and that's the real thing about it, it will feel like a very personal journey within the membership, where we've got your back, and so where we sort of talk, talked a little bit about other methodologies, where you've got to kind of work out what's going to work for you, that's exactly the kind of thing that Ingrid can help you with, because we can see where you might be struggling and where we can direct you appropriately. And that's the beauty of a membership over a book to be fair and a course. You know, it's that personal input that's really important, isn't it, and that's why, seven years ago, when we were going to put together decluttering courses, we decided that was not going to be enough for us, and actually that we wanted a membership to really help people that were struggling. Yeah, so declutter.com forward slash book is where you can find the book if you want to buy that Declutter. Hub com, forward slash trial is where you can find the information about our trial. We'll pop all the information to the show notes as well. Won't we Ingrid so that, yeah, you can find that.

Speaker 1  34:56
Yeah, definitely. So let us. Know, you know, tell us, are you going to give us a go? Are you want to do you want to try out our decluttering methods? Let us know in the comments. Sign up for a trial like Lesley said, declutter hut.com, forward slash trial. We would love to tell you more about the reset your home system and how it can be so beneficial, and how it's helped so many people all around the world with their decluttering and organising, but for now, thank you so much for listening, and we hope you've enjoyed it, and we will see you again next week.

Speaker 2  35:34
Thanks so much for listening to the declutter hub podcast. Don't forget to subscribe to us in your podcast player so you don't miss an episode and we'll see you next week.
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