A graphic of 2 women cleaning a messy room
Episode 281 – How to declutter without making a mess

We’ve all been there! You decide that today is the day you want to declutter. You pull everything out of your cupboards and then are faced with piles of stuff with no order. You think to yourself, what on earth have I done? Then because of your overwhelm you close the door, leave the room and don’t come back for days. This is what we call the messy middle and in this podcast, we help you to avoid that.
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Transcript of this podcast episode
00:00
We've all been there. You decide that today is the day you want to declutter, and you pull everything out of your cupboards and then are faced with piles of stuff with no order whatsoever. And you think to yourself, What on earth have I done? And then because of the overwhelm you leave the room, you close the door, and you don't come back for days. This is what we call the messy middle. And in this podcast, we'd love to tell you how to avoid that.

00:43
You're listening to the declutter whole podcast, bringing you tried and tested no nonsense tips and advice from the leading experts in decluttering, and organizing your home. Now here are your hosts, Ingrid Jansen, and Lesley Spellman.

01:06
Hello, and welcome, listeners. I'm Ingrid. And I'm Lesley. If you're new to the declutter hub podcast, you're so welcome. What you'll find is that we try and find a fun factor in the serious business of decluttering. And if you've been in for a while, you know exactly what we mean. So thank you so much for listening. If you'd like to get involved in conversations related to this podcast, it all takes place in our Facebook group. So come and join our lovely, warm, supportive community. To find the Facebook group go to declutter hub.com forward slash group to find out more, or you can search for the declutter hub community on Facebook. Well, Lesley, the messy middle. Oh, my words. How many times have we seen it happen? I know exactly. It's a big isn't it? It's like a It's just something that happens all the time. There's actually like Facebook phonies, about it isn't. I always like what have I done? What have I done? Because you get kind of over enthusiastic, don't you? And you sort of go yeah, this is what I'm feeling. It's gonna pull everything out of those cupboards, and then I'm gonna sort it all out. And it's a surefire way to become completely overwhelmed, isn't it? Exactly, exactly. And it doesn't matter which room it is, you know, it can be warm drops, it can be pulling everything out of your food cupboards, it can be hard, just a random cupboard somewhere. And let me just pull everything out and see what's under there. And then it's like, how is it even possible that so much stuff is fit in this cupboard or wardrobe? I didn't even know how much how much was in there. And I think that's it. If it's not if it's something that you're not well practiced at, it's an easy mistake to make, isn't it? It's something that certainly you know, I remember when I first started out as a professional organizer candidate, something quite similar, really where, where I just kind of dragged everything out. And then I was like, Oh, I mean, this was like I can, I can still remember my first client really vividly. And just it was complete chaos. And I think we really stand behind process and order and control, don't we Ingrid? And so whether that's the decision making process, or or whether that's the logistic, logistical, logistical, we are all about process and order, aren't we and having a kind of controlled journey. And I think whether that's the decision making process, or whether that's how you do it logistically, then I think you need to feel 100% in control all of the time. It's hard enough having to do make all the decisions and all that, but we need an orderly environment in order to be able to do our best work their way. So what we wanted to talk about today was indeed the messy middle, which scares people off running for the hills never to return to a decluttering project. So what can we do to avoid the messy middle we're gonna talk about before you even get started on a decluttering project? Or when you're about to get started? What kind of practical things can you put in place to avoid that? We're going to talk about how it all unfolds in the messy middle because it's it can you avoid it completely, can everything be super controlled? Probably not. So we're gonna talk about the middle bit of it. And then we're going to talk about what you do towards the end of a project to make sure that if you have to return to the project, that you're all set up for success for tomorrow or whenever you come back to it right. Well, it sounds easy, Lesley.

04:29
But no, no, it's not so I think we really need to dive in and and give people some good advice. Give our listeners some good advice because oh boy, your boy that that messy middle is tricky to avoid and you know, you do at one point, always look around a little bit and go wow, it looks Messier here than it was before. But if you do it in a structured way, you know, it's just a bit of a hill you need to climb and you can go back to being more orderly.

05:00
later. But yeah, there's always a bit of chaos and mess involved when you're decluttering. And organizing, you know what I've just been thinking about? Because we've always said, and we've talked about this before that we would never, we don't think that you and I working together would work well, you know, with a client in a home, you know, I think we would maybe kill each other, actually.

05:21
Were the other side of a computer generally. Yeah, I just don't know whether we do because I don't think we do things in the same way at all. We don't think in the same way. So I would imagine that my messy middle, even though it's not messy is messier than your messy middle. That's that that's the conclusion that I've come to my version of a controls kind of environment and yours are probably very, very different.

05:46
I never thought about it this way. But you're probably right, Lesley, I believe Oh, that's good to know, that's good enough. And you be like, No, we need to cross the eyes and dot the T's before we continue. But anyway, if so it's not really about us, it's about everybody else. So we've got a good handle on what the messy middle is, let's give a give an example. Now everyone's probably got one of those big sort of catch all cupboards and there might be a bit of stationery in there a bit of crockery in there may be some craft stuff in there. Some school books, a bit of shoe political be anything in there, right. But it's just a big cupboard with lots of different types of things in it. The last thing that we need to do at this stage, is pull everything out of the cupboard all at one go. Otherwise, it's completely chaotic, and overwhelming, and difficult to see the wood for the trees. Right, Ingrid? So how do we go about doing something like that? How do we avoid the chaos that we're talking about? Well, I think it starts already, Lesley, before you even start pulling stuff out, you need to have a bit of a setup. And what do we mean with that, you need to already have a bin bag ready where you know, if I found some rubbish, I'm going to put it in a bin back. I would also have a bag ready for recycling, whether that's a kind of a maybe a see through bin bag, or maybe a box or something where if you find something that needs to be recycled, like cardboard, or anything like that, that you can already put it in there. So you need to think about okay, what kind of things am I going to find? And how am I going to tackle this project and not just go right? Okay, I'm ready to this cupboard, opened the doors and start pulling stuff out just randomly from this cupboard. You need to think about your setup and go okay, what can I expect that can expect rubbish, I can expect recycling, I can maybe expect to find some things that need to go to other rooms. So let me create a bag for that so I can have something to carry it around with.

07:47
Let me sure baby, you know, if you're starting that later, the days will it gonna be a bit darker? Do I need to have some extra lights do I need to or maybe need to open the curtains to create some light in so to kind of make the space a bit inviting for you to work with? Yeah, and the very important thing that you've not even mentioned in grid is to try and get something for donations, right. And so hopefully most of his stuff is going to be able to be donated. Now, I'm not sure how you do when you're working with organize your house. But certainly as the clutter fairy we, we definitely have different color bin bags for different things. And so we're obviously going through big volumes of stuff, perhaps, you know, when we're working with a client, you know, we get through quite a lot of stuff in a day typically. So we need to have a good handle on what's going where. And I think that really helps the feeling of control. So Ingrid was talking about a different bag for recycling. So for reals we use black for like actual rubbish or trash or whatever we use. Clear see through stuff for donations. So the thrift shop co charity shop wherever can see exactly what's coming in. We use heavy sort of like those heavy duty sacks like you can use that you can use them further like dry sacks the cold here or you can use garden sacks as well for things like paper and cardboard.

09:09
And so and then we use red for stuff that is going to be given to somebody else as well. So we've got four different color bags. So we're not suggesting that you need to go out there and buy four different color bin bags because actually, from a normal supermarket, it's not that easy to get four different colors. But what is readily available is dry sacks, and garden sacks, which are typically green that you can use potentially for your donations, and black bin liners. Those are readily available in every supermarket. All the stuff is available online. If you want to go down that route, but don't overcomplicate it, we've obviously got big volumes. So we're using hundreds of bin bags every month and stuff but it's useful to know what's in each bin bag because if you put everything into a black bin liner, you're like, Oh, was that the donations? And was that that? What was that the recycling which was it and you lose control and think it's that important? Isn't it? Good to feel that good?

10:00
trow? Yeah, absolutely, I use three colors as well. And the less the black is rubbish. The heavy dry is normally for recycling and paper and things like that. And the green are used for donations. So I think it's I liked that that was then Norway, but sturdy. But if I've got a lot of crockery and ornaments, then I will see, can we maybe use an empty box that the client has in their house, or maybe that's not broken down yet for recycling, to put stuff like that in there, and you can kind of then carry it a little bit safer. So yeah, just have a little bit of a plan. Don't just randomly pull everything out. And it's also really nice Les, he teaches us some labels, something so put a sticker on there, you know, so if you don't have all these different colors, and you're like, Oh, I'm gonna get confused. put a label on there or a sticker on there saying This is rubbish. This is recycled. This is donation, this is to go back to a friend this is to go to another part of the house. So you have a really, really good overview of what is going in what Yeah, because we're all about breaking things down into manageable chunks, right angry. So when we're talking about I was working with clients, you know, typically we would get through one room in a day or in a session. Sometimes it's a little bit more for we don't, but we need to think about the fact that we might have to stop that session at some point during the day and return to it. Yet another reason and with the best will in the world, we forget where we got to. And so as well as having things labeled up on your bin bags and things like that, or having labels ready to put on your beanbags, it's useful to have some kind of boxes, typically, that might be able to stack that's also quite useful. So you can kind of, you can like lay them out while you're working while you're gathering like we'd like and making decisions about things. But then at the end of the day, you can kind of try and return the room back to normal by stacking these boxes, vertically upwards. And so we love a collapsible crate, don't we angled to kind of, you know, to gather like with like, and then you can put on it. So I just use a little postcard over the handle of the collapsible crate or over the edge of the box or so this is what it is. And you know, and then you can keep on adding to it. That's the thing, you know, you can keep on adding things to so you've got to, before you even start to take things out, you've got to think about your process. It's so important, isn't it? So the planning, what am I gonna do? What categories are gonna Am I gonna think about we talk a lot about goals, you know, what's your goal for the day? Have I got the equipment that I need for success, last thing you want to do is pull everything out and think, oh, gosh, now I need a bin bag and I need some cleaning stuff. So gather all that sort of stuff together before you get started. So talked about bin bags, we've talked about getting boxes to sort into, and we've talked about having sort of temporary boxes, you know, the problem with a lot of rooms Ingrid were in when we were working in quite full houses, is that often the containers have already got stuff in them, right? So. So you might want to kind of amalgamate a couple of things to create some free boxes, if you've got them. If you haven't got any at the moment, you know, sort of amalgamate two things together. And you'll come back to them at some point. So yeah, so we're all set up? How are we going to put our boxes or bags or wherever we're going to sort into what do you typically do in grid? Well, I try to always, if a room is quite full, Lesley, I just first tried to create a bit of space, so I can actually move myself, you know, if if the door of the room can even hardly open, then I probably have to kind of wiggle myself in and kind of try to get some, maybe cardboard boxes are things that are empty out first. So I can actually have room to open a door so I can actually I can go in and the client can go in. And then I normally try to kind of jet carefully stack some stuff. So I create a place where I can work, whether it's on the floor, or on the bed or on a table. But you need to have a little bit of room because if you need to constantly step over things. It's that's that's dangerous. And you can damage things. And of course, you can trip over things. So it's really important to create some room to move. Yeah, definitely. I mean, the ideal scenario is that you can put like 10 collapsible crates or bags for life or wherever you're going to cardboard boxes, wherever you're going to sort into, well, nicely next to each other and you can just move around. But that's not always possible, logistically, isn't it? Yeah. But I think, you know, just think about the process of how are you actually going to, you know, look at the things that you're going to keep How are you actually where are we going to put them and is it easy for you to get access to those, you know, those are actually a designated area for things that you're going to keep. So, okay, so we've thought about that. We've got bags, bags, we've got boxes, we've thought about what we're going to do. The main thing is that you don't if you've got one of those kind of catch or covers that we're talking about. Don't drag out all your photo albums or ebooks or your stationery or your shoe polishes.

15:00
blah, blah, don't do all of that sit, if there is some kind of category in there already try and stick with those categories, of course, there are going to be things that have kind of got a little bit wayward, but try and go kind of one category at a time. Right, Ingrid? Yes, I think so. I mean, you know, if you're working with a casual area, it's really important to

15:21
put like, with like, I think that's crucial, because then you can get a really good overview on okay, what is going on here. So if you've got, I don't know, a computer in your living room, and you're like, okay, everything is in there just labeled one of the crates or boxes, this is where all my notebooks and writing stuff goes into. And every time you find a notebook or, or anything like that, in the box that goes, then you create a separate one for stationery. So every time you find staplers and scissors and pens and all of those random bits in a crate together, then maybe you've got maybe in your living room, some DVDs or CDs or whatever, create books where you put music or TV and put things together. And then we start to spot them in different areas where you can really put like, with, like, the categorization is crucial. Yeah, again, to keep that control that we're talking about, we need. The whole process at this point is actually trying to gather like with like, and keep things together. So you've got a good handle on what you've got on what the volumes are, that they're all together, that they're sorted or not sorted. I mean, let's go to a breaking good. And then let's come back. And let's talk about the process of deciding what you're going to keep and what you're going to let go of and where that fits in. Yeah. Hi, everyone. Welcome back. We're talking about the messy middle. And we're actually in the middle of talking about it, aren't we? Lesley? Yeah, we're in the messy middle of the podcast. It always gets messy in the middle, doesn't it? Ingrid? And I think we've really got to think about how do we make decisions, and what do we do with the stuff, this is where the real messy middle butt kicks in. And so ideally, you pick an item out of the cupboard, you know, it depends on how you've done it, you might have pulled everything out and put it into a box, you've got everything together. And you can work through the box like that, you might be making decisions as you take things out of the cupboard before you gather like with like, but ideally, this is a decluttering exercise. And so what we want to do is we want to make a decision about something, whether it's a yes or a no, whether you're going to let it go, whether you're going to keep it and you need to put it straight where it's going. So that's either going to go into the kickbox categorized ideally, or it's going to go into donation if you're going to donate it, or it's going to go into rubbish or recycling. And so you need to start doing that now. So the you've got to really put these things where they're gonna go. So what you don't do is take it out and put it to one side and then go, I'm gonna worry about that later, what you need to do is with every item that you get to, you make a decision on it there. And then the only exception to that is things like clothes, if you're you've decided that you're going to do a train on session, which we would highly recommend, you don't really want to try things on in the middle of your decluttering project, you can, it depends, sometimes it's a good idea to do that. And sometimes it's a good idea to do a full trial session at the end for things that you're not sure about. But I think it's so important that you've made a decision that you aren't going to make that decision straight away and you're going to go with your gut reaction, you're going to try and push yourself out of your comfort zone. And you're going to make sure that the things that are kept going one place the things that have been donated are going to another place. So so important don't have a kind of, or I'm not sure about that, pick it up or don't notice it on the floor. And then I don't know whether it's gonna go in the donee or whether it's gonna go in the kit. That's where the messy middle comes from, right Ingrid make a decision. Even if you gather like with like as you go along, you still got the opportunity to return back to that and go let me have another little look at that gathered like with like stuff and do a kind of almost a second pass on it. So if you know that it's going to go it goes straight into a donation bin bag. So a lot of people what we find is they kind of don't think about the bin bag thing at the beginning. They kind of keep things to one side in a big pile. And then and then go oh, did I saw that? Where was that stuff from? I'm not sure then we have to go. That just stays there. That's where it's messy. Right. Yeah, make concrete decisions as you're working. This is not something to procrastinate over. Yeah, it this is absolutely true. Lesley what you're saying? Because I think when you take something out, you need to follow your follow your gut feeling as well. You know, when something is recycling, you know, if it's an empty toilet roll, you know, you know it's gonna go into recycle if it's broken, you know, 19 out of 100 It's broken needs to be thrown when you're like, oh, it's actually something

20:00
I don't want any more I can donate that goes straight in. But then what happens with the keep stuff is the people go, Okay, I want to keep Senate put it in one pile of all the stuff they want to keep. And they don't sub categorize it into their different categories like with like, and then what happens, you get this massive heap of stuff that then needs to be sorted out again. Yeah, because people want to keep a lot of stuff. Of course, you know, we can't go overnight to a minimalist house, so people like it, but I want to really keep that, because what is so important about putting, like with like, and that sub categorization is that at one point, you get to realisation Oh, wow, I actually do have a lot of notebooks. And you don't know that when you declare, when you're trying to go through your cupboard, you're like, I got a couple of notebooks. But then you suddenly find out, you've got 37 notebooks and you're like, and they're all together in a box or in a crate, you're like, I had no idea. And then you can do a second pass on those notebooks and go, hold on a minute, this is far too many. I don't need this many in my house. Let me now look through this category and declutter some more. And I think that's where a lot of people kind of, they just decide, okay, I'm just going to keep it and keep it and keep it but they don't then put a structure in place on putting them all together. So in with the idea to go through them again, at some point. And then it all kind of gets shoved in because then it feels really overwhelming with there's a whole heap of random stuff all again in one big pile. And then it's like, Yeah, but I'm really tired now. And I've done all this already. Let me just put it back quick in the cupboards, and then it all gets put back in a completely chaotic way, which then does withheld because then you know, you've got the eggs, but you still can't find them. I know. So the key is categorizing the stuff that you're keeping and categorizing the stuff that's going because the stuff that's going has got as many categories as the stuff that that you keep paying, because it could be given to somebody else recycle thrown in the bin, gone to the charity shop, gone to a different charity, gone upstairs to your son's bedroom gone to the kitchen. So there can be several categories of things that need to be relocated or re housed out of that actual room as well. So don't procrastinate on the decision. Don't go Oh, ugh, it's high when we see it's like keep go donate you know, like, it's like way too simplistic. You see it on like on socials don't yet have a key box have a donate box have a TO GO Box. And it's like, but you need like loads of different categories. It's not as simple as keep put it in a box, donate, put it in a box and the donation a little bit more perhaps simple. Because hopefully, if you've got one charity shop that will take everything, then it can all go in one box. But even the recycling and the trash has to be changed the glass got to go somewhere, papers got to go somewhere. Then you've got things like books, which involves something else because it's not going to go in a normal bin bag. And it's all you know, and it all needs to be thought through at the beginning. So you avoid this messy middle and you know exactly where you're up to. Talking about not procrastinating on decisions. Ingrid, let's talk about the look at later. Not able to make a decision just yet. But what are we thinking about that? Yeah, well, I mean, I think that is something that we can completely get on a soapbox about Lesley we just don't like those boxes. We don't like the may be things you either keep it or you don't. And actually from you know, people who have listened to us at the podcast at the beginning of the year, and at the end of last year, we know we have the mantra. If in doubt, keep it or if in doubt, don't throw it out. And I think that is really important. If you're uncertain about something, you put it in the keep box because you will go through that category of items again, you might have changed your mind maybe not that day, but maybe two months later or two weeks later. But if you're unsure don't just and that doesn't mean you can keep every onshore item that you've ever had in your house you have to like let's you said step out of your comfort zone on a regular basis I'm gonna go I know I'm not sure but you know what I you making this decision with the best intentions with my what my current life and my future life will hold for me. But if you're really really struggling, keep it you will be able to make a decision that sits better with you later. Yes, absolutely. So okay, so we've done our preparation we're in the middle of our kind of we're in the right in the messy middle trying to

25:00
Make decisions trying to move these things into what potentially might be 10 or 15, different places, different categories of stuff to keep different categories of stuff to go. different categories to relocate for different rooms, there's lots of different areas, this is why we need to keep control of this. And then we go one bit tired. Now, I've kind of done for today, you know, we need to recognize fatigue, whether that's physical fatigue, or whether that's decision fatigue, we're done with making decisions for day. Because today, because if we think about it, every single decision that we make every single item that we come across, needs a decision. And even if that's just to keep or to put it in one of the 15 categories that we've got, it kind of takes emotional energy, and we need to recognize that. So when we've got tired, when we get tired of doing this job, we need to make sure that we can return back to it fully in control of where we got to today. So we need to, you know, for different people, that's going to mean different things. Some people like to take notes about it, some people can put labels on things, you know, you might need to do a little bit of tidying up, I would definitely advocate, you know, if you have got a decent amount that the charity stuff or the donation stuff goes out of the room and ready to go to its next destination, you can do it, you know, massive advocates of if you're doing a big decluttering job, go into the to donate to donate these things to charity shop on the day, incorporate that within your decluttering session, if you're going out to the shops to pick your kids up whatever, try and do a little rerun and just take it even if it's only one bag, it's out of your house and out of your kind of vision. And so it's so important to do that we do it every single day. So when we're working with a client, every single session that we do involves a charity shop run at the end of it, it's a non negotiable for us, because it's important to see that project through to its end. Now, if you're in the middle of something, and you've all you've only done 15 minutes or 30 minutes, because that's all that you can manage for today, that's fine, you're not going to Bob off to the charity shop with two things every time because that doesn't make sense either. But you need to kind of have a bit of a plan as to where that's gonna go. So how do we then prepare for the next phase in this project? Ingrid? Yeah, I think I think it's really important that at the end of a little decluttering project, little toss that you've been doing, have a couple of minutes of tidying up time. And indeed, you know, get this stuff off the floor, get the recycling out, put it outside of your recycling bin get the backward rubbish out, move the indeed donate the items to be donated to your donation station or straight into your car to be donated on the next time you're going out to the to the to the shops, and you're passing the goodwill on charity shop. I think that that is really a part of a lot of people forget, they're tired, they down tools, and they walk out of the room. Without us going hold on a minute, let me to spend a couple of minutes, just tidying it up here, putting a label on the crate set on the box that we create or have a Sharpie of hands, if you're working with an empty Amazon boxes have a Sharpie of handing out business stationery, this is music equipment, these are bits of toys that I found. These are board games, this is wrapping paper and gift tags and cards. I mean, I mean the random the item, but write a couple of notes or use some extra sticky post it notes or use a label or a sticker. So you don't have to think the next time you come back, which is maybe a couple of hours later or the next day or three days later. Oh, what was I doing here? What was going on? What's going on here? What was this? You know, and if you're if you're been back for the rubbish is absolutely full, this is the moment to take it, carry it out and put it outside in your in your beds. Don't leave it in that room and have already made even put in a next empty bin back there ready for next time. So you don't have to kind of go you go, Oh, yeah, I'm ready to go. And you'll save yourself a lot of time.

29:17
I think as well. You know, one of the things that we're big advocates as well of England is, you know, leaving paperwork, for example, to later in the process or sentimental stuff later in the process. And so what we sort of say is if you find things that are going to be difficult while you're decluttering something that's less difficult, I mean, not that anything's easy, but sentimental and paperwork are great examples of that. Don't spend the time now trying to make those tough decisions. So what we would advocate is you find paperwork while you're decluttering just put it into a box and don't worry about it and deal with it all together later. But sometimes there might be things that you need to you need to look at that and you need to go I need to make it clear on this paper because obviously there's paperwork, but has it been sorted has it been looked

30:00
So is it recycling. So for example, you know, you might keep one box full of shredding that you can do later, it needs to be very clear that that has been sorted in is ready for shredding, for example. So it's not just here's the categories, it's also, if you've got bigger volumes, that's a sorted box, or that's a box for recycling or whatever that might be. So make it clear whether or not you've already gone through it, because sometimes you can lose track of that as well. And we all forget, don't we forget things. So it's all about, you know, preparing for that next session. Because if you go into a room that's completely overwhelmed and chaotic, you're going to want to walk out before you've even be gone, you know, so the first session where we're like, Let's get together, let's get the BIM basics, got the boxes, then we started to gather, we didn't tidy up after this session, you know, we walked out the room because we're a bit tired, and then we go back in I don't want to do that. That's way too hard. And then you walk back out again. And that's when we struggle to gather momentum and keep that momentum going on our decluttering journey, right? Yeah. Anything else that you want to add, enrich the message, but I feel like I want to be in the middle of a dig, I feel in my head. Now. I'm like, I'd love to do like a catch all cupboard, you know what I mean? And just get stuck in of crates, and labels and sorting. And, but I know, we're just sat here recording podcast, which is equally nice. And cannot really get stuck in some way. I know it, you know, it's, it's so satisfying, isn't it? I mean, even I mean, that's, I think one of my favorite bits of decluttering. Is that even just to see the categories appear, and go see, now this can go together with this one and that, and it's like so satisfying, because you already know that you're so much further ahead, just having like with like things together. So you can actually make, you know, a decision over over the things that you think oh, as firstly, like the clients like, oh, I want to keep everything and then like, actually, no, I don't. I can declutter more. And I love it. Yeah.

31:58
So in summary, the important things are to prepare before you go in for battle, let's call it

32:06
to make sure that the middle part of it is controlled. And that as you're sorting things out, you categorize into, you know, like with like, and the things that you're keeping, you keep that very heavily labeled, and you also send the stuff that you're chosen to donate to that to their own individual categories of donation, recycling, garbage, whatever that might be. And then even if you get really tired, in the same way that we advocate, doing, evening resets, same principle, push yourself to do five or 10 minutes at the end of a session, so that the next time you go into it feels calm before you get started. And absolutely do not pull everything out at once. Go category by category or section by section or small manageable chunk, you know, it might not even be categorized in your cupboard, but only take it one step at a time, then sort that out, categorize it on and go, Okay, I'm ready for another pile. Okay, I'm ready for another pile. You know, we just say and particularly in bedrooms, and stuff I'm seeing where people pull everything out of every cupboard and every drawer, because there's no order in it to start off with and think, Well, I've got to put it into order. But it's still got to put things into order in smaller chunks than it is to do everything with this principle of trying to get all of your clothes out and put them on the bed however, well mill is that. Yeah, yeah. I mean, people have got hundreds of items of clothes. You know, if it takes a couple of minutes to make decisions. I mean, how much time is that? You know, we don't do that we go one section at a time in wardrobes, don't we, Ingrid? You know, it's important to keep it manageable, so that it doesn't become you know, emotionally overwhelming. And so

33:49
we could talk all day about the messy middle Commonwealth. I know. I know. And I would love to know from you listeners. Have you ever fallen foul of the messy middle? Do you have shivers down your spine? Your well, you when you heard us talking about this? And got it? Yeah, I've been there. I feel it. I know. And do you think our tips have helped you to avoid this messy middle and feel more in control? We would love to hear from you leave a comment in our YouTube channel. That's where you can listen and watch to our podcasts as well. In the comment section, let us know if this was helpful for you. We would love to know don't be Lesley. We do love to know and of course you can leave comments on our website as well. You will be talking about this in the Facebook group. So you can put comments on you know, we have various posts about what's happening on the Facebook group. So we want to hear from you. We do way too much talking about Ingrid.

34:43
Well, I think people hopefully enjoyed because I mean, this is podcast 281 allegedly so yes, thank you for being here. Thank you for listening in week in week out. And yeah, we appreciate you so hope to see you next week.

35:02
Thanks so much for listening to the declutter hop podcast. Don't forget to subscribe to us in your podcast player so you don't miss an episode, and we'll see you next week.
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Tara says:

18 February 2024 at 3:15 PM

This podcast came at the right time. I am resuming from the messy middle I stopped at months ago. Due to health issues and the requirement for ongoing Physio, as well intentioned as I have been, little could get done. I can confirm the safety risk of repeatedly stepping over boxes, almost spraining an ankle in the process. I have 4 different colours of bin bags I packed items into over summer stacked up all around me, black, green, teal and silver, in addition to the transparent recycling bags I put donations in. I taped the bags shut, cannot recall which colour was what category and didn't buy more labels as I already had a packet of them in here…somewhere. I refrained from marking bags with a sharpie at the risk of the ink transferring through to clothing or papers inside. I made a minimal amount of space over the past week which is at least enough to re-start from, as my health is finally slowly improving. The ladybug that's been traversing my curtain for almost a week now might be a lucky sign but I am feeling quite unsettled at the prospect of finding actual creepy crawlies or worse that could have hibernated in the stacked cardboard boxes in my warm studio over winter. Seriously, I am now wearing a hazmat, goggles, gloves, shoe covers and all; whatever it takes to get it done.🙃

Reply
1. Ingrid Jansen says:
  
  20 February 2024 at 4:58 PM
  
  Hi Tara, thank you for sharing and lovely to hear you're on the mend and are starting to feel a bit better. Make sure not to overdo it now, but work slowly but surely instead of going all guns blazing now. We don't want you to tire yourself out.
  
  Reply
PaulaJ says:

16 February 2024 at 4:21 PM

While listening I dumped 2 boxes on my bed challenging myself to finish sort/toss/recycle during the podcast. Yep. Sitting in the ‘messy middle’ here. I sort on my bed so that it will get done and can get in it to sleep at night! I’d say this method has a 90% success rate for me. And yes, I did finish by the end of the podcast!

Reply
1. Ingrid Jansen says:
  
  16 February 2024 at 4:45 PM
  
  Hi Paula, well done on doing 2 boxes. That is fantastic work.
  
  Reply
Episode 281 – How to declutter without making a mess

Episode 376 – Countdown to Christmas – prep early, stress less

Episode 375 – Ingrid’s Birthday Bonus – Home, Life and You

Episode 373 – Getting Intentional with Gifting for the Festive Period

Episode 372 – The Opposite of Swedish Death Cleaning with Guest Alison Binney

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