A graphic of a travel map and travel items, passport, compass, camera, postcards and phone
Episode 191 – Maps and travel guides

Episode 395 – Don’t Fade by February – Keep Your Decluttering Momentum High
Episode 394 – The Hidden Story Behind a Hoarded Home with guest Eileen Stukane
Many of us use maps and guides to navigate our way around the world and also to make the most of where we are. But as the world becomes increasingly digital, what do we do with the paper based versions?
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Transcript of this podcast episode
[00:00:00] Ingrid: Many of us use maps and guides to navigate our way around the world and also to make the most of where we are. But as the world becomes increasingly digital, what do we do with the paper based versions?

[00:00:15] Lesley, this podcast has been a long time coming.

[00:00:19] Hasn't it? Traveling guides and maps. We were all ready to record it. And then the pandemic hit and nobody went anywhere for about two years. 

[00:00:31] Lesley: So it is literally, this was originally episode 78 and we're now on episode 191. So that just shows you how long it is. 

[00:00:43] Ingrid: Was 

[00:00:43] Lesley: it then? Was it the beginning of the pandemic?

[00:00:44] I feel like it was this time in the pandemic. Yeah, 120 episodes. Yeah, that's about right, isn't it? Yeah. Honestly, so, so we had it all prepped. So obviously we need to try and remember what we prepared back in 2020. 

[00:00:57] Ingrid: I know, I can't even believe it. And interestingly enough, I recently went away for a couple of days and normally I'm the one with the travel guide, with the map out, like opening it up and it's being blown away.

[00:01:12] And this time around, I only used my phone and I'm like, wow, what has happened to me? I'm like this paper based person. I'm changing as we're, as I'm getting older, I'm getting with the program, Lesley. 

[00:01:26] Lesley: I think it's all my, I think it's all my looks, all my disdainful looks at you the whole time, like. We are running a business based on technology.

[00:01:34] Ingrid, please get with the program. Like she's like, Oh, I really like a digital calendar. She literally resisted for eight years that I've been working with her. And now, now she's finally made the jump. She loves it. And now you've moving on to digital maps. Well 

[00:01:51] Ingrid: done you. I, I did miss my map a little bit.

[00:01:56] Not going to lie. Just kind of to find your bearings, but yeah, no. I mean, of course, I mean, I've been using Google Maps on my phone for years to go to stuff, but when you, when I go, like, away, you really, I don't know, I really like reading a guide, and about the history, and about the place where I'm going, and doing a bit of research, and walking around with a map, being a Proper tourist.

[00:02:19] Lesley: I can just imagine you there with your map out in the middle of the thing, like all opened up, like this huge map or whatever. Steve loves a travel guide as well. I, you know, travel guides are a different thing. We're going to talk about those later, aren't we? But yeah, I think, I think sometimes it's nice to have that paper copy.

[00:02:34] It's a bit like, Oh, I'd quite like to have a physical copy of a book rather than just everything be online. So we can get that information elsewhere, but sometimes people prefer. For the paper based version. So let's get going. So what we wanted to talk about, really, we think there's two reasons why you would use.

[00:02:50] A map or a travel guide, and that is either to navigate your way around the world or to get information about what to do when you're there. Am 

[00:02:59] Ingrid: I right? Yes. Lesley. Two ways indeed. One is like proper, like is a map and the other is like the old fashioned kind of almost 80 Z books that we have, that we actually, we see a lot in our clients' houses, don't we?

[00:03:14] Yeah, 

[00:03:14] Lesley: people kind of still like, quite like an A to Z. I don't have an A to Z. Do you have an A to Z? Of course you do. 

[00:03:19] Ingrid: Of course you do.

[00:03:25] Lesley: I can't say... She's thinking, by the way. She's... We're actually doing a podcast. You can't just sit there and think for 90 seconds before you answer because people are going to think there's something wrong with the audio. Have you got 

[00:03:37] an 

[00:03:37] Ingrid: A to Z? I can't remember. I would say yes. I would probably say yes. I would definitely say yes.

[00:03:44] Lesley: In fact, I'm going to go come to your house and find one. I just know that you're an A Z girl. Not that there's a problem with that, but if there was anybody that was going to still have an A Z, it would be absolutely Ingrid. So she's going to go looking later and she'll come tomorrow. When we're on a meeting tomorrow and show me the A to Z, this is what's going to happen.

[00:04:01] So no, everybody, the audio wasn't a problem. It was just that Ingrid was taking a little bit of time to think about a question, which was really obvious to answer. Anyway, we digress. I'm being, people think I'm very mean to you all the time, don't Ingrid. You know, just outing you for being the kind of person that you are, um, which is not necessarily a problem.

[00:04:22] Okay. Let's talk about maps then. So we have something, is this like a worldwide thing? Ordnance survey? Is that like a British thing? Did you have an ordnance survey 

[00:04:32] Ingrid: in Holland? I, yes, I do think so, but I remember them from Ireland when we lived in Ireland because my husband loves a map. So I love a guide.

[00:04:43] My husband loves a map. So because he just loves walking in general as well, like, like proper walking through, like, you know, when you go like a day with a rucksack and water and that kind of thing. Hiking. And he, he would buy like a map from like very, very detailed in where you can see like the tiniest little walking paths on there as well.

[00:05:07] So I know Ordnance Survey from, from Ireland, I believe. 

[00:05:12] Lesley: Yeah. So are we saying that we think it's just. A British and Irish thing and not, we don't know, we don't know. Well, anyway, in this country, we have something called an ordinance survey map, which is kind of has coordinates on it. And it's a very, very detailed map of everything that you need.

[00:05:29] So it'd be the kind of map that you kind of open up that I said, I can imagine Ingrid in the middle of Rome, opening up something the size of a picnic blanket and looking at her and maps. To try and navigate her way around. And so ordinance survey maps, maps, typically they're still around. It's still very much in use.

[00:05:44] It's still super useful because you can't rely on Google maps when you're up a mountain. I wouldn't have thought you need something that's got a bit more detail in it. So that's what ordinance survey maps are. But one of the problems that we've got when it comes to ordinance survey maps is that if we go back years.

[00:06:01] So for example, I can remember when I moved to Holland, everybody knows, or some people know that when I was. I lived for a year in Holland. And so obviously that's back in the serious day, a long time ago, 20, what is it, 30, is it 30? It's not 30 years. Yes, it is. It's 32 years ago. How scary is that? And so when I went off as an intrepid explorer to go across into Europe as a 21 year old in my car, we had to do that with a map.

[00:06:30] You had like an atlas, didn't you? And you opened it, which is kind of the, an ordinance survey map is kind of more for walking. And then you had atlases, which would be more for driving, I guess. And so I had to do that. I had to navigate my way to Holland. And then actually I went on a trip to the South of France as well.

[00:06:46] With an atlas, you know, there wasn't any kind of Google maps or SatNav or anything like that. You have to kind of work it out, didn't you? And so you definitely needed that. But again, generationally, a lot of people still keep hold of those, even though they use SatNav, this is the problem. 

[00:07:02] Ingrid: True. And I mean, your, your story about traveling in Europe reminds me of when we used to go on holiday with my parents, my mom would spend many an evening trying to plot our route through Germany and Austria on our way to Italy, to the Garda Lake or something, trying to figure out what was toll and what were tunnels and what would be busy and not, and which were like main routes and other stops we could make along the way.

[00:07:30] You would not just put it in a computer. It wasn't there. You know, she would spend the evenings putting all the maps. She had a map of France and Germany and then she would put them all together and then get the atlas out and It's like was a whole thing. I think it also was part of her enjoyment of preparing the holiday But that's a whole other story.

[00:07:48] But yeah, it used to be very very very different and In all honesty, I still have an Atlas in my car. So of course I've got a sat nav in my car, but I do have an Atlas of Europe and of the UK, because there has been occasions when the sat nav doesn't know what it wants to do. And I always have a paper version in my, in my door backed up, but it's, I think it's 10 years old now.

[00:08:12] So I think, you know, we might need to go for an updated version at some point, but. I have it as a backup there. Yeah. I mean, I, 

[00:08:20] Lesley: you see, I suppose, I mean, you're right. You know, it just depends really. I bet anybody under the age of 30 wouldn't even dream of having any kind of paper based version. Because of course, even if you're sat nav, which is kind of a thing that's associated with your car, suddenly breaks down.

[00:08:35] Then you've got your phone, haven't you? You've got your phone. And so you're going to kind of find a way, aren't you? But some people generationally struggle with that and don't want to rely on it. And, you know, there's definitely going to be something to do with age. You know, it's this kind of crossover, isn't it, from paper based.

[00:08:50] To digital based and how happy I was to make that transition. And so what we're talking about today. Well, again, you know, in the same way that we talked about last week when we were talking about collections, it's not for us to say that you should declutter your maps and atlases and travel guides, not at all.

[00:09:07] But we want you to ask yourself some questions which is. Are you still using these or are they taking up valuable space? If you've never looked at an atlas, an A Z or 10 years, which is absolutely me, then they don't deserve a space in your house anymore, unless it's potentially for sentimental reasons, which is a whole nother thing.

[00:09:27] Ingrid: Yeah, I think it's interesting, Lesley, because A Zs, you know, some of them have been used so much. They're like completely falling apart, pages are half ripped. And it sometimes even becomes a sentimental item because people were like, Oh, I remember traveling through London when I was still working in London and I had to find my way around and I had this little pocket A to Z in my backpack or in my office bag or something.

[00:09:57] And it's almost a sentimental one, but sometimes it's like, you know what? We just don't use this anymore at all. It can definitely go. But I think if you're right, I think it is, it's interest again, very, very interesting how technology has changed the way we do things. 

[00:10:16] Lesley: Yeah. You know, I think it's interesting because I can say, you know, even though I've completely switched into a digital thing and I'm fine with that, I'm glad to have had that time with paper based versions as well, because I feel that I've got a better grip.

[00:10:28] On where things are in our country, for example, my kids wouldn't have the slightest clue whether to go to Cornwall, you'd go North or South, East or West. Do you know what I mean? Like, they're just to be like, I don't know, just put it in the sat nav and off we go, you know what I mean? They're just, I think the kids just are so reliant on Google maps and things like that, that they don't have a geographical handle on things.

[00:10:50] I'm not saying I'm perfect, but I did do a lot of traveling around the UK with my job in my twenties. And I definitely have a feel for. If the sat nav went off, if I had to get rerouted, I'd have a vague idea of what kind of route to take, and I think our kids would be completely stumped if that happened.

[00:11:07] Completely stumped. They wouldn't have a clue. And so, you know, I do think we lament what's happened. gone before really, you know what I mean? Because I think it's nice to have that idea, but I've still, even though I've traveled around Manchester, I've lived here for 30 years, I still have no clue where things are in the city at all, like no idea.

[00:11:23] And so I do struggle with that, but you know, the country countrywide, I have a bit of an idea, even going across into, into Europe, you know, the Holland, Germany did a lot with maps there when I was there and did a lot of travel in there. I've got a feel for that geographically as well, not massively, but I think I have a feel for where it all sits.

[00:11:40] together. And I'm not sure that our children do unless they've studied it, you know, more in geography or something like that. Yeah. 

[00:11:46] Ingrid: Yeah. Yeah. I think, I think one other thing that also pops into my head, Lesley, is what, why I do love a map, especially when we're like traveling, uh, on our holidays or something, and.

[00:11:57] My husband does a lot of the driving, and I'm the one who kind of navigates everything around that. But I do love looking at a map and going, Ooh, there's a castle there, and how far is it from there? And ooh, there's a lighthouse there. Because there's loads of stuff you can see on a map, that is super interesting.

[00:12:13] So I think it's also... I don't know, maybe an interest in, in the area and history and what's, what's around. So it's not about the roads alone. Is it a map? Yeah. No, you're absolutely 

[00:12:26] Lesley: right. But I think I, you know, we're going on holiday soon and I think that I would totally go on to Google and say. When I'm traveling down this road, what's close by that I need to see, and people will have written travel blogs and all of those kinds of things.

[00:12:42] And I think I would pick up more information from that. So I think it's all about that information. We have much more information than what a map can give you, although it's much more specific. And so I don't know, I find myself a little bit torn, but I've definitely moved into digital. But the question is, you know, we can talk about maps and what we do all day long.

[00:13:02] The question is, what do you do? Where do you feel comfortable and have you still got things in your house that you are not using? That's what this is all about. Have you got maps? Have you got A to Zs that you are not using? And if you think, do you know what? You know, I'm more in the Lesley camp than the Ingrid camp.

[00:13:20] Then perhaps it's time to offload them because it's something, it is... Something that's got a sentimental value, I think, because there's a lot wrapped up in those atlases. There's a lot wrapped up, as you said, in those A to Zs, you know, happy times, trying to navigate your way around, you know, normally when we're traveling, it's for fun when they're always actually often for business and things like that, but a lot of times we're doing it for leisure.

[00:13:41] And so there's a lot of sentimental and emotion wrapped up in that. And that's why these things are hard to get rid of. 

[00:13:46] Ingrid: Yeah. Well, let's take a break and after the break, let's talk about travel guides.

[00:13:53] Hi everyone. Welcome back. Before the break we talked about maps and A to Zs and atlases. And now we're going to talk about travel guides. Now Lesley, my eagle eye can see behind your head a whole row of travel guides.

[00:14:11] So if you're watching this on YouTube, you can see this too. You have a whole row of travel guides. 

[00:14:17] Lesley: I do. And I keep my, I'm not a book person, you know, as soon as I've read a book, it's gone, but my travel guides are truly, truly sentimental to me and don't open them up, but I just keep them there on my shelf to look at a sentimental items.

[00:14:32] I would, if I was going back. Those places, I would absolutely look at those travel guides. And, but typically I go to different places. And so I don't go back to somewhere that I've already been, not always, but most of the time. But I love to keep that sort of history of where I've traveled. Cause I've been some pretty cool places to be fair.

[00:14:47] And so I love my travel guides on there. So they are, they are sitting above my head in my office. And it's something that I've always kept for sentimental reasons. Do 

[00:14:56] Ingrid: you make notes in your guides? Lesley, do you scribble or make mark things or highlight stuff or? Okay. You know, me, you know, me with the notes.

[00:15:06] No, I 

[00:15:06] Lesley: don't know. I've not, I never take notes in books. No. As we were talking about before the breaking with travel guides are kind of like maps and atlases where you would get all your information about where you're going to eat, where you're going to stay, what you're going to do. All of those things would be in a travel guide and you were at the mercy of the person that had written that travel guide as to their recommendations.

[00:15:25] And so you might have, Oh, these are five hotels that you can stay at when you're in Los Angeles or something like that. Do you know what I mean? Of course, we've got this abundance of information. We could, we could, we know the information on all, how many hotels would there be in Los Angeles? Thousands, probably.

[00:15:40] And we could get information about all of them. And so it's very different times, isn't it? But there's something still very special about that travel guide. I just love having it. And so to me, travel guides were information. As to what to do, my husband still loves the travel guides. And if we go anywhere, he will get a paper based copy, which is nice for me.

[00:16:00] Cause then I keep them from sentimental reasons, even though I would find my information out digitally, I would find that out on a Google search. He would read the guide. I would keep the guide. Does that make sense? 

[00:16:10] Ingrid: Yeah. Yeah, definitely. I mean, you know, the answer to my own question for me, right? So I normally don't make notes in books, but travel guides is a different story.

[00:16:20] So I actually. Very carefully. During a trip, when we finish the day, I will take my highlighter out and my pen out and I will go, We were here today, write in the dates when we were there, uh, what we did first. So I'll keep a log, some sort of log in my travel guide very carefully, not like scratching things out and stuff.

[00:16:39] So I will, I will read it in advance. I would buy the guide, read it in advance, plan what we're going to do. And then use it on holiday and then mark where we are. So when people once said to me, Ingrid, you've been to New York, have you? I'm like, yeah, and I've got a guide. Oh, can we borrow that? Because then we can copy your travel plan because you know, you wouldn't even, we know you would have spent lots of time trying to figure out what to do, where and how to all fits it together.

[00:17:04] So we can just copy your plan. And I'm like, you go for it. 

[00:17:08] Lesley: Yeah, no, I mean, I sort of typically, when I go away, I kind of. I plan things and I put, I print things off and I put them into a folder that I would use and I'll put in chronological order. So it's kind of a similar thing, but then I probably do discard that to be fair when I come back because it's no longer needed because I've got the kind of photographical evidence of where we've been.

[00:17:29] Yeah. Yeah. 

[00:17:30] Ingrid: Definitely. Yeah. 

[00:17:32] Lesley: So travel guides for me, then I'm an unusual, it's unusual for me, isn't it Ingrid, to keep something like that. I must admit that it's just one of my things that I've always done, but let's talk practically about travel guides. If you're not like me and you're not too sentimental, should you be keeping travel guides that are 20 years out of date, for example?

[00:17:49] I think the 

[00:17:50] Ingrid: answer is no. I'm like you, I keep them out of sentimental reasons because I use them as a log and kind of a diary. So I've kept them too. I have thinned them out, so I have kind of gone, If I have several of one area, for example, when we lived in Ireland, I had eight or nine different guides and I would use the same one over and over again.

[00:18:11] And the other ones as reference material and backup and be pre, pre computer and all of that. So I decluttered lots of them. So I think if it is an item that, You've used the information gets outdated. The pricing is not correct anymore. The restaurants don't exist anymore. The hotels are now named different way.

[00:18:30] I mean, probably the street and stuff is still the same, but you couldn't go traveling to New York with a guide from 10 years ago because it's, it's all changed. So you have to get an up to date version. So if it's not an memorabilia or sentimental item, I would say declutter it and let it go. And if it's really, really old, it will probably, and it's not.

[00:18:51] Anything really special, it will probably, you know, go to recycling because why would a charity shop want a guide that is eight years old with outdated information? 

[00:19:01] Lesley: I know that's what's hard. And that's the kind of decision that people really struggle with because they would think, Oh, here's a guide to New York.

[00:19:07] It's 10 years old. Actually, 80 percent of information in that book would probably still be good. So all of the. Kind of historical stuff would be good. The history stuff would be good. The climate stuff, all of that would be absolutely fine. But the restaurants and hotels would be probably out, out of date or, you know, things like that.

[00:19:24] And so that's the kind of decision that people really struggle to make, isn't it? Shall I send this kind of thing to the charity shop? I would be with you, which is. No, it needs to go into paper recycling because actually if somebody were to buy a guide, they would want the most up to date guide. Does that make sense?

[00:19:41] And so I definitely would put that into paper recycling, but that's hard, isn't it? Because it looks like a good book. They're expensive books. You know, you're probably talking 25, 30 pounds for a travel guide, aren't you? These things are not cheap, you know, because to let them go. Yeah. Now there's something else as well.

[00:19:59] Kind of like a travel guide, but not a travel guide, which is leaflets that you collect of places to go. So this maybe might be a little bit more local or typically it might be when you arrive at a hotel and they've got one of those stands in the front desk with here's all Places that you can go in this area.

[00:20:17] Now, if it were you Ingrid, you would have it mapped out, um, meticulously for 17 hours a day with no scope for any diversion from that. And, but for

[00:20:29] me, it just turns up and but I'd be like, Oh, yeah, that sounds nice. Let's do that today. What do you do with those? What do you do with leaflets that you pick up and think, Oh, that would be a nice place to go. What, how do we deal with those? 

[00:20:40] Ingrid: Well, I think, Lesley, I think when you're there, actually, on holiday, I would kind of keep them and kind of go, if you're, if, if there's like a day that's not been planned yet or an afternoon that has a gap, you can kind of go, Oh, that sounds interesting.

[00:20:55] Let's check that out. Or, and, and you could use it while you're there. But definitely the first thing I do when I come back from holiday or before when I do my packing to go back home, I would go, Oh, these are all the things that we didn't go to on holiday. I'm going to leave them here in recycling because I'm not going to take them home and then do that or when packing is, is kind of crazy and busy and quick, then I would say, let's pack it up.

[00:21:20] And then at home, I would go right here. Where's all the paperwork? Okay. These are the tickets and the, the, the, the, the ticket from the boat and the toll and all of that. That can all be going to shredding. And here's all the booklets of things. Okay. Let's see where I did. I go to that goes into my memorabilia books and the stuff that we didn't do goes into recycling.

[00:21:38] If it is local, I think it's different because I do pick up sometimes kind of things in a library or, you know, when you go somewhere and you find an interesting leaflet, it's like, Oh, that sounds good. I've got a special place in my house where these things live. So if I want to plan a day out or something, I want to kind of.

[00:21:56] Have some ideas of where I could possibly go. And I kind of leave through that, but I, I keep that manageable. I don't have 12 boxes full of leaflets in my house of things that I might go and do someday. I 

[00:22:10] Lesley: think the important thing with leaflets is really. Putting them into a place where you're going to be proactively seeking them out.

[00:22:16] And so I think I probably kept hold of more leaflets when my kids were little, probably because a life wasn't quite so digital then, particularly going back 20 years when Luke was a little one. And so I think that I would have picked up more leaflets then, but I would definitely put them somewhere where I knew.

[00:22:34] That that's what I, if I was going to be planning trips out, because when you've got little kids, you're planning, you have to be planning things, don't you? For school holidays and things like that. And so I think I would have more of them now. I can't remember the last time that I picked up a leaflet because I would, if I saw something on a wall, I would take a picture on my phone, you know, that kind of thing I would, most of my research would absolutely be done online on the phone as we got somewhere and all those kinds of things.

[00:22:59] And so I just think I'm, I'm, I'm completely digital in that regard. 

[00:23:02] Ingrid: Yeah, I had a flashback, Lesley, when you talked about kind of when you go somewhere like in a hotel and you find this whole stand of leaflets and things. And it reminded me so much about when my husband and I, uh, back in the day when we're not even married yet, we're traveling in the US.

[00:23:21] And if you go from one state to the next, always on like the state border, they've got this amazing, like information center. When we were traveling back in the day with like walls and walls of leaflets. And it was like, for me at the time, it was like heaven because you didn't have, you had like your, indeed what you said, you had your, your lonely planet.

[00:23:44] And that was this about it, that you had to work with that. So you need to have more. About the local area. It was just absolutely amazing to see what kind of leaflets and also discount codes from motels and hotels. And, uh, 

[00:23:56] Lesley: don't talk to me about discount. I mean, I was, we were obsessed. I mean, I spent, we spent quite a lot of time in our early twenties and kind of.

[00:24:03] Mostly California and Florida and stuff like that. And, um, I want to say a lot of time, like a few holidays. I mean, I don't think I was like there like the whole time, sadly, it would have been nice if I was, when I was here, but yeah, the coupons, you know what? You could literally get like a motel room, you know, a super eight or whatever they were called, I can't remember what they were called, you get a coupon for like 19 to stay overnight.

[00:24:25] And so we lived, eat, eat and breathe these coupon books. Cause I, I don't think we had them in this country. Same level. So it was definitely an American thing, I think at that time. So yeah, the coupons were everything. And then when I moved to America, when I was in my kind of thirties, I understood that a lot of American life is based around discounts and deals and coupons.

[00:24:46] And even shopping, when you go to the supermarket, you know, people very rarely shop these days. It might've changed now, of course, cause things are much more digital, but you know, you'd always have a coupon of some kind, wouldn't you, when you went. It's a supermarket wise and we do a little bit here, but not quite as, as much.

[00:25:00] But yeah, coupons and discounts were very exciting because it's called, it's called the blue something, the blue, I thought it was called like a blue book or something like that. I can't remember someone who lives in the States or has traveled extensively in the States needs to tell us because English and I have got these, these nostalgic flashbacks to life when it was, you could get a motel room for 29.

[00:25:19] Like as 

[00:25:19] Ingrid: if. It was, it was like amazing. And then we would, I would be, because you would have, you know, especially traveling in the U. S. You have these long stretches of road where nothing kind of happens. And I would be the one going, okay, right. You drive. Where were you going? Let me see if I've got a coupon of a motel.

[00:25:35] And I remember kind of going somewhere and they're going, yeah, yeah. But we don't have that one anymore. Sorry, we're going to another one. What's my backup plan? So I would have like. Choice A, B, and C ready for, to coupon things. I mean, it was like, again, in, in Holland, we didn't have that at all. So it was like.

[00:25:52] Wow. This is amazing. So I'm having a complete flashback now talking about leaflets and coupons, Lesley. I love 

[00:25:59] Lesley: it. And I think my take on this is actually, it was nice, wasn't it? It was nice to be paper based. And to kind of seek things out for yourself without having, it's a double edged, I don't know. Do I prefer having all that information at my fingertips or do I prefer, it was a bit more, it felt a bit more adventurous somehow, didn't it?

[00:26:22] Didn't quite know what you were getting. Whereas now I have to make a conscious effort when I'm on holiday. So a few weeks ago, we went on holiday to Jordan and we went to Petra, which is obviously. They're one of the seven wonders of the world. And I was really key. Like I don't want to look, I'm not saying I've never seen a picture of Petra.

[00:26:38] Of course I have, but I wasn't going to start looking at every picture of Petra. Cause I didn't want to spoil it almost, you know, you can almost spoil it before you go, whereas we didn't, you know, I remember we're going to Yosemite national park, which is. Honestly, my favorite place in the entire world.

[00:26:52] I'm being completely blown away. If I had seen those pictures before I went, it would have taken away, maybe it wouldn't, cause it's quite impressive to be fair, but do you know what I mean? I just think there's something very exciting about discovering things for yourself rather than all that information coming to you, but it doesn't take away.

[00:27:09] We, we could literally sit here for another half an hour talking about our troubles in our twenties, but maybe that's not what people are here to talk about decluttering. So maybe we 

[00:27:19] need. 

[00:27:19] Lesley: Talk about decluttering. So let's get it back to the topic in hand, Ingrid, and stop waxing clerical about our travels and talk about the fact that should we be keeping these things?

[00:27:31] Even though you and I are like, Oh, I love that. There's a lot of things that I love about the seventies and eighties, loads of things. We're not in the seventies and eighties now we're in the 2020s. Is that what it's called? The twenties. I don't even know what it's called and things are different. So should we then be keeping things?

[00:27:46] That don't serve as well in our current lifestyle. This is the question. Yeah. 

[00:27:51] Ingrid: And I think we, we go back to almost like sentimental items that go for the quality over the quantity. You know, we're not saying throw away every map, every travel guide, every leaflet that's ever touched your house. But. You, what you don't want is to have boxes and boxes full of stuff that you never ever look at again.

[00:28:11] Again, it's all, it's about balance as always, isn't it, Lesley? So, I feel good that we can now travel again and we can enjoy ourselves a little bit on our trips. Whether you stay local or, or go far away. Just being able to go out is nice, isn't it? Let's 

[00:28:29] Lesley: be honest. You know what I'm going to be doing?

[00:28:31] Because I am going to America again later this year. And so I'm going to be looking for that coupon book, 

[00:28:38] Ingrid: whatever it's called. I'm going to be 

[00:28:39] Lesley: like, I'll be scouring the like petrol stations and stuff. And I mean, like, whatever. So yeah, that'll be very exciting. I'm totally going to. Seek out the coupon books and see if they're still around.

[00:28:50] I bet they are. I bet they are. I'm not going to lie. So if you're from the States, tell us about those coupon books and remind me. I feel like it was called blue something. I don't know. Maybe I've got that completely wrong. 

[00:29:02] Ingrid: Okay. Well, I've enjoyed talking about this, Lesley. That is for sure. A lot of nostalgia going on here, but I've really enjoyed it.

[00:29:11] Next week, we're going to talk about storage solutions. Lesley and I can't live without. So thanks for listening and we'll see you next week.
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