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Episode 304 – Feng Shui, Reiki, energy and decluttering with Ange de Lumiere

Ange de Lumiere is a business owner, podcaster and author who helps entrepreneurs set the foundations for their business so that they can thrive without having to sacrifice their health, their relationships or their sanity. Reiki and healing was what kickstarted Ange’s journey with decluttering and in this podcast we delve into her fascinating story.
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Transcript of this podcast episode
00:00
Ange de Lumiere is a business owner, podcaster and author who helps entrepreneurs set the foundations for their business so that they can thrive without having to sacrifice their health, their relationships or their sanity. Because these goals are so aligned to the decluttering world, we invited Ange onto the podcast, so we can delve into her fascinating story.

00:28
You're listening to the declutter hub podcast, bringing you tried and tested no nonsense tips and advice from the leading experts in decluttering and organizing your home. Now here's your host, Lesley Spellman.

00:50
Hello, and welcome, listeners.

00:51
I'm Lesley, we're delighted you're here to join us as part of your decluttering journey. So whether you're brand new today, or have been listening for ages, we want to say thank you so much for being here. It means so much to Ingrid. And now that you turn up every week to listen to and support us. While we talk all things decluttering and organizing. We'd love to help more people with their quest for a clutter free home. And our podcast is a fantastic way for people to be inspired to take action, we have a favor to ask. If you like what you hear, be sure to hit the follow subscribe or like button on your podcast player. share us with your friends, or share your thoughts on the podcast by leaving a review. And welcome to the podcast. Thank you so much for being here.

01:34
Thank you for having me. It's a pleasure.

01:36
So you're in our Facebook group, and you're always sharing your brilliant insights with other people. So we thought it would be amazing for you to come on the podcast and to share your story. So let's jump straight into your early life what made and and so let's talk about your early career, where you're from how you ended up in the UK and all those kinds of things. So tell us a little bit about your background. And

02:00
okay, so initially, I had a 15 year career as an international business lawyer. And from Paris in France, I studied actually the double curses, as we say back there, translation school, English and Spanish, in parallel with the law travelled the world, which exposed me to a lot of different cultures, which is fun. And I had a chance to go to Hong Kong. And I think it's kind of linked to what's gonna come next. Because once I had an offer in London, so I moved to London in 2001. I didn't realize but the company that I started to work for was a company that had been created by Hutchinson, and they were very much into feng shui. So that was fun, because it's almost like I had an introduction to Feng Shui. Just before I moved to London, should I share a little bit about what was happening and how that helped me? So yeah, so. So I was at a point in my life where everything seemed to be stuck. I was in a job where I had a sort of glass ceiling, and I didn't seem to progress. And I was a bit bored. My marriage was not going well. I have lots of health issues. And so I went to my GP who was a little bit of an enlightened person in a way that she was a yoga teacher, and she was interested in other things. And she said, Well, why don't you go and see my shiatsu massage, she might help you with the stress and everything. And then one thing led to another and this woman, her husband was actually a healer. And then they both tried to help me and then she said, Well, why don't you consult my mentor who's a Feng Shui master of Vietnamese feng shui master, and I thought I'd try anything at that point. I was very open minded because you know, when you're kind of desperate, I don't mean to sound you know, pathetic, but when you're when you're really, really stuck, and I had actually three brushes with death back then. So I was I really wanted to know what was happening in my life that was affecting me so much. And so there's this very pleasant Chinese, I'm sorry, Vietnamese man came to my house, pointed out at three things. I've never said a word to him. And he literally picked up the three areas of my life that were blocked where I had problems just by looking at my house. Wow. And that blew my mind. So he and then he explained to me just a little bit, not too much because he was more interested in giving me the cures. So he asked, and this is the funny part. He asked me to put like a fishbowl in my living room above a piece of furniture and he said, it doesn't matter if it's a real fish. You can put whatever fish you want and that's including maybe your, you know, a toy or whatever. Then he asked me to put some chimes in two doors that were facing opposite each other and then he asked me to put mirror In the weirdest of places in that my house, including in some wardrobes, that who puts mirrors in the wardrobe. Anyway, I thought, I've got nothing to lose. This is an experiment, let's have some fun. And of course, my first husband, who was a lawyer, and a very, very cynical, very sarcastic had the biggest laugh of his life, when he saw what I did after the master came. But within literally weeks, I had the best job offered to come to London, a job that I absolutely adored, my health improved. And what was and of course, my marriage ended very shortly after that, which is, which was for the best. So I'm not saying it would have been the best for anyone else. But for me, it really worked. So this made a really strong impression on me, because I was like, How can this man who knows nothing about my life just looking at that might my house resource energy blockages or something that's happening in my house that's stopping me from flourishing? So of course, when I moved to London, I found this flat that I thought was perfect for me. And so I sent him the, you know, the the plans very quickly, is it okay, yes, he you know, it is charming Vietnamese accent you said? Yeah, yeah, absolutely. Happy house, go ahead. And in truth, that was exactly what happened, that house was had a lot better energy. And as I mentioned, just before I started this anecdote, I worked for a company in London that had been created by Hong Kong, people from Hong Kong. And, and they weren't a sanctuary as well. So it's like, well, already, that's a coincidence. That's pretty interesting. So when I walked into the premises in my new job, the energy felt different. And at the time, I didn't understand what that meant I was a lawyer, right. But I could feel that the way that had organized the offices, the way that they placed everything, it felt completely different from my office back at back in France, it was nice to come into the office, if you felt happier, just the lighting was different, everything was different. And so I think this sort of solidify, my understanding that wherever you work, or wherever you live, has a massive impact on your well being. Regardless, if we talk about clutter, or not, you know, at the very start the structure that has the placement, everything is important. And then from there, I learned a lot more, but we don't need to go into the detail of it. Just yeah,

07:25
I just I would just say just a little bit of detail if you. Okay, I just want to say what's the idea behind. So by putting mirrors into your wardrobe, then that shifts the energy focus a little bit within that space is that what is that what so I

07:41
can explain to what happened because I didn't have this problems before I moved to that flat, it's literally when I moved into that flat looking back with insight. And what happened is the flat was not a square or rectangle shape. There were at least two places that were missing in it. So it was more like a sort of L shaped. And and then the other thing that that happened that I thought was significant, because I did a lot of research after that to try and understand because obviously he only had an hour, he wasn't going to stay very long. Our flats was in a modern complex of buildings where there was people who could walk underneath part of it. And apparently, that's also bad for energy, according to the Chinese. So I wasn't the first floor it was the second floor. But there were people who could literally there was like a street that went underneath our flats. And that's also very bad for energy. So apparently these two things created all the problems that I started encountering when I moved in the flat. And the previous flats I had before was much more rectangular, there was hardly any of these spaces missing. And I'm pretty sure that in your episode about Feng Shui, she talked about the Bagua, which she she talks about the fact that it's a Western, and it's it's simplified and departing quite a lot from what she practices. But I have found in the work that I've done myself more intuitively, because I haven't trained in Feng Shui, don't, don't get me wrong, I'm not going to pretend I'm an expert or anything. But I do know a lot about energy now. And I could see the impact. And I'm whenever and I observe whenever i Wherever I go, I could just look I'm curious, ask questions. And and it's very late, the fact that it's not, especially if it's a house that's working, or if you get into your entrance through something that's not unusual, you know what I mean? Or people even who get into their houses from the back door that has an impact on how you the energy of your house feels really there's a

09:38
fundamental there's a fundamental thing with the property makeup itself, you know, no less. We'll talk about the placement of the front door and you know this and that's where mirrors and things like that can counterbalance that kind of thing in Feng Shui, right if it's, if it's based,

09:53
as I said, I'm not an expert I know. Now having done my research knowing the flat that what he did, he was trying to make up for the missing parts in the flat with the mirrors. So the rest I'm not entirely sure. I think the two doors facing there was some sort of energy, whatever. And I have to trust, you know that he was I mean, he solved the problem. I think that it's always my attitude is that I might not understand, but it's solved. So if it works, I'll do it again.

10:23
Yeah, whatever works. So tell me about so you come over to London, early 2000s. You've got a new career, you've got a new flat. So where do we go from there.

10:35
So I'm quite simply, about a year after I moved to London, I decided to move to the southwest of England because I had two small children under five. And I thought it'd be nice for them to have a garden rather than live in the flat in London, even though we love the area. It was becoming quite expensive as well. And, and from there, the company that I had sent me, I was like, I was not an expatriate. But I was seconded to a subsidiary of the company I worked for back in Paris, and they decided to restructure everything. And so they pulled the plug, and they said, either you come back to Paris, or you're made redundant, and I decided to stay. And from there, I had this redundancy package. And I thought, I'm gonna give myself permission to explore all the things I've never allowed myself to do. Because I was this serious girl, you know, who wanted to have a good career and studied law and did all the things. But at heart, I was an artist. And there was a lot of things that fascinated me that I wanted to explore. So I started doing Bart for 10 years, I did exhibitions in my local art trail. And I had been fascinated by hypnotherapy through reading books back in France and trying to understand how the mind works. So I trained clinical hypnotherapy, which gave me a lot of insights of her creativity work sexually, and all sorts of things. I don't know, one thing led to another I decided to train in, in spiritual healing than in Reiki, and then all sorts of other bizarre things started to add up, you know, psychic, mediumship, tarot, all this stuff. I went a bit wild. And then I pulled it all back together. Probably seven years ago, about seven years ago, I had completely denied my past as a lawyer. It was almost like it was a different life. And then I realized, no, it's still me. And so I tried to combine everything that happened to be almost the two halves. And that's when I started calling myself a spiritual lawyer. But also, I started working, going back to work with business people, because for those past 10 years, I've done lots of things more with people in their private life. And so, since 2018, I've been supporting entrepreneurs with all the things that I've learned specifically about intuition, on how to integrate that into their decision making process and all sorts of things. But sometimes I'm I do the things that don't seem related to the business. But that are really important, because I'm sure you know, as an entrepreneur, that you bring all of you into your business, if something if affects you in your home, or affects you in your private life, it is going to impact your business. So even though I work almost exclusively with entrepreneurs, there's still I still deal with a lot of what's behind the curtain, so to speak, if that makes sense. Yeah,

13:28
so you've definitely So you took your the sort of Reiki and the healing and the energy side of that brought that into your business. And that's what you do today. And we're gonna talk a little bit more about that after the break. But one thing that I want to explore as well, is the fact that whilst you are going through this process of building a new business and changing your mindset, and things like that about your home, and all those kinds of things, your children, you are autistic, right?

13:54
Yes, yes. So I have four autistic children to them, and are young adults. And two of them were actually technically three since March, because my third turned 18 in March, and then I have a 13 year old as well. So this was a massive disruption in my life. And I'm not saying this. I hope it doesn't come across the wrong way. Because I adore my children, and I wouldn't want them any different. But it's true that it's it's brought a completely different take on my life. It's changed the way I had to create a business around my children. Basically, one of the reasons I left corporate is because it became more and more difficult for me to combine a full time job and the needs of my children. Yeah,

14:40
absolutely. So what what so what did you bring from you know, so obviously decluttering has been a big part of that. And so at the end of the day, so talk, talk us through the clutter and decluttering and all that kind of stuff. So yeah, with the with your focus on energy and healing and obviously having to focus in quite a different way with your children and their needs as well. So talk about your clutter to us. How did that manifest? What was that like?

15:07
So, what happened is after I have my third child, and at the time, I only thought one of my kids was autistic, his dad moved in with me, and he had hoarding behaviors. And on top of that, I started to become quite overwhelmed, because I was a single mom of two. And then there was this new child. And it turns out that all these children had much bigger needs than I ever anticipated, because you don't know what your children are going to be like, before they're born. And then I had a third child, and all the people work from my business, the home all that it started piling up, the mess started piling up, the kids were constantly playing with the mess. So it was difficult. And so I came to a point where the house was a complete pit, I have to say, and I don't feel, you know, I do feel ashamed about it still a little bit. And I had to reverse that tendency. But for by the time I started to tackle my clutter, or the clutter in the house, to be more precise, because it wasn't only mine, obviously, probably six to seven years of paperwork had had accumulated in boxes, I had seven or eight boxes of paper, you know, and things from France as well. So two different countries, as well as business and home and it just became completely unmanageable. So one day, I just decided, I'm going to tackle this, and I did one box at a time I put it all in the same room, then I started, I actually only finished paperwork. And that was really interesting listening to your podcast, because you always say do the paperwork last. And yeah, I started with that a little bit. Because it was becoming unmanageable. I couldn't remember where my kids school reports were, I had all these assessments that had to happen for the four children. And I don't know if people have the same experience the UK, but I had to fight doctors, I had to fight the NHS, everything was so much and I had to fight schools, I even had to fight my family back in France, because they didn't understand autism and thought that I had done bad parenting, whatever it is. So everything turned into a battle, which is why also I think all that clutter started to because I was managing I was almost constantly in a state of crisis, I think you've only

17:17
got so much capacity. And you're not I mean, that's the thing, you know, a lot of things and you've got four children who said it, who are autistic, you've got a husband displaying hoarding behaviors, and perhaps not being as supportive as you need him to be. And you've got all of this stuff, but you've only got so much capacity and so many hours in the day to do all these things. And your children were your priority. And then there's all this additional kind of administration involved. And you know, that's a lot, you know, anybody who's gone through anything and you right, it's that fight that constant battling with people and having to have everything in order having to have proof of all of the things to prove to people that you need to help and support, it adds a whole new dimension to it adds a whole new filing system into it as well. So I'm not sure I started there, because that would undoubtedly be the thing that you felt most overwhelmed by. And so probably a good place to start, even though there's a lot to learn before you get to that point is, you know, from the podcasts that I've listened to, and so on. And but yeah, we feel your pain, because that's a lot. I mean, you know, as I say, there's only so many things that one person can do and can achieve. So, but you came out the other end of it, right? I

18:25
did. And I think I thank my younger self for being a lawyer, because at least I know how to write letters, and I know how to make an impact, and get people to listen to me, even though English law is a bit of a mystery for me compared to French law, but we won't get into that. So. So I started by actually decorating one of the rooms taking the wallpaper down, even though I felt completely overwhelmed, I had to start somewhere. And then I made my way I had a plan in my head that I would go through the entire house, one room at a time. And and it worked. Even though at the start, it's almost I don't know, if your clients have experienced it's, it's almost like you have to get the energy started. And then there's some momentum that starts to build. Yeah. And even though you feel like nothing shows, and that's why, for me anyway, I always start somewhere and I don't move from that place until I can see something. Whereas I used to make the mistake of tidying here there everywhere. And then it doesn't never shows. And so you get discouraged because you don't see the results. Yeah, I think

19:26
it's so important to see the result because that's what's gonna motivate you to continue. And so yeah, I stay in. And we're big advocates of staying in one room or even one small area at a time or an area of a room. Until that's completely done completely. You can see the fruits of your labor, which will then motivate you on to continue. But without that finished step. It's very hard to be motivated because it just feels overwhelming as if you're getting nowhere. So it's so important to stay in one room. So it seems as if you had a great strategy that paid off.

19:54
Yeah, and it was quite intuitive at the time, but I can see where the inside that was exactly what was needed and And the interesting thing is I had a second wave of decline. So this took six to seven years. I just wanted to. And I think that's why Lesley sorry, Ingrid felt that it was important that I come up with a couple cards to show that it could take a long time, and not to be discouraged. And then about a year ago, after I divorced from my younger twos, dad of my younger two children, we had to put the house in the market. So that was another impetus. And I'm really proud because the estate agent came to take some pictures in January, and the house finally looked like the way that I've always wanted it to look, do you know what I mean? Like, gorgeous, and decluttered. and spacious. And and people even commented on how amazing it looked. So just to say that it's even if everything seems to be stacked up against you. And I need to add, even though I don't want to talk about him too much on the podcast, because, you know, I'm not here to upset him. But my ex constantly told me that I would never get there and not even to bother starting on the decluttering that I was a messy person, even though he added to the mess and never helped with the tightening. Do you know what I mean? He was like very. So I think I'm not saying if I can do everyone else can do that. Because I find that actually invalidating towards other people's challenges. But I suppose I want to inspire or give hope to people that even if they start very small, and it feels like it's they're never going to get to the end. Just to keep going. Yeah, I

21:29
think it's just that these barriers that that were in your way, you know, difficulties or struggles or whatever can be overcome. And so other people with similar or different struggles can overcome them. If you just set your mind and have a good goal and have a good idea and a plan and all those

21:46
supports. I see yours, your membership, like yours is absolutely beneficial. Your group is wonderful as well, because you get inspired, you know, you see someone and I have been inspired by your group. You know, I see someone decluttering their pantry. I'm like, oh, yeah, that's what I'm going to do next. So because you forget, and you think, oh, no, what can I do next? I don't know. I don't really feel like it. Yeah,

22:10
absolutely. Yeah, there's something where it just puts a little bit of a spark of energy into you and makes you kind of go, I used to do all the time, when I was working with clients every day, I would be doing jewelry projects or a scarf projects, and it would put a little spark into my mind, I'll come home and get stuck into my own anatomy. So yeah, there is something about that. So we're going to pop to a quick break. And then we're going to come back, we're going to talk a little bit more about your decluttering journey and how you've taken what you learned in your kind of early years and put that into practice with your clients that are mostly entrepreneurs, kind of everybody and welcome back. So in the first half of this podcast, and she shared with us how she had moved from France to England, how she had various things that kind of she struggled with along the way. But she found a way to to break through those barriers, with particularly with energy with Reiki with things like that, she's gonna talk about that a little bit more, because she's now taken that into a business journey where she helps other entrepreneurs build their businesses based on this. So your your decluttering journey, and it took you a while it took you six or seven years. And so do you feel that you are decluttered? Now I know it can never ever be final. But do you feel that you've got your home in control now?

23:24
Definitely in control, because all the day, the areas that have been decluttered have stayed decluttered. And there's a system, there's no access. So it's easy. Everything has its place, which was very hard for me to find to start with. I will say there's one room, that stage and that's waiting for me for the move. And I'm not I'm kind of procrastinating I will say about that room. But most of it yeah is under control. And there's nothing like that feeling honestly, especially knowing where everything is supposed to go. That helps so much.

24:02
And was there anything with your you know, we talked briefly about your children and about the fact that they've got that they have got autism. So was there anything specific about them their neuro diversity that meant that you decluttered in a different way? Or do you just think it was the same thing there was different things that you needed to consider.

24:22
So I'm not too sure if there was something I did differently, but I will tell you that the clutter had a big impact on them. Because it wasn't cluttered from the start like my first kids. We moved to London, they've had problem with clutter, then I wasn't the most organized person but you know, things run smoothly in my house. And then it's it's probably when my third son turned three years old. And his dad moved in, as I said with his hoarding tendencies, and then the overwhelmed on my part that things started to You know, get cluttered. Let's put it this way, I definitely saw an impact on my kids behaviors, they were much more agitated. And even though, you know, I don't know if there's any science behind that, personally, as a mom, I could see that the clutter has an impact on them. And I could see it on the other end, because the more I decluttered, the, the easier that behavior became as well, if that makes any sense. And so have you still got

25:25
some children at home? Right? At home, so do you think that the things that you taught them have have gone with them, the ones that have left home, that is, I've gone with them their next destination. So

25:38
it's kind of interesting, because as you know, they all have different personalities and become their own people. So of the two that have left home one is, is quite, quite organized. And quite, I wouldn't say Zen, but has doesn't have any excess. And the other is the opposite. So, you know, whatever you teach your children, they do whatever they want for them in the end. And

26:00
sometimes it comes in waves as well. So sometimes they start out, when they get their own space, that you know that they're happy with the kind of independence of being able to what they do. And then all of a sudden, they realize further down the line that perhaps they do want what they left, you know what I mean? And so they do start to put organizational systems in place. So you've alluded to the fact that you all of these things kind of came together. And now you've built a business based on all of your early learnings about decluttering, about energy and so on. So you want to tell us a little bit about that, and how how decluttering in particular fits into that.

26:35
Okay, so I wouldn't say that I do these kinds of things very often. Because I'm more like of a an online business mentor. So I have people who want to have more of a presence, especially coaches and people in the service industry. But what I've noticed is that if they come to a certain block, or if there's an area of business, that's difficult, then we'll look at whether there's some clutter there, because I know that has an impact. So using the Western feng shui, burger bread, we can look if it's the fortune area, then that could be their social media PR, if it's the financial corner, then we'll look at it. And I had a particularly interesting experience with one of my clients who's one of my oldest clients. And she she was constantly hitting a blog and including wouldn't get paid by clients. So I said, Look, I was looking at your house, what what can we do, and we had talked about this several times. And every time I tried to suggest that she starts decluttering, it wasn't happening. So I decided to use some of the tools that I've learned in Reiki, she gave me a plan of her house, and she lives in Japan, and I'm in the UK. So there was no physical interaction, which might seem even weirdest for your audience. And I apologize for that in advance. But I always ask people to keep an open mind. So whatever I did a clearing of her house. And that's what the Vietnamese men did as well for my flat, you know, after I moved to London, and literally the next day, she started decluttering, she hadn't been able to declutter for absolutely months, if not years, and the energy just cleared and she's been she's done her balcony, she started on her kitchen, and I think she's done to her bedroom. And that's literally within the past two to three weeks. So it's kind of reinforced me in the understand, I never assumed that what I'm going to do is going to have an impact on my clients decluttering journey, because I think that would be vain and a bit presumptions. But But I was really pleasantly surprised that this had an effect and that it helps her. And the reason why it makes sense to me with the understanding I have of energy genuinely, is that I know that letter, blog blocks, things like it. I know it wasn't clutter in my first flight in Paris, but it was the bads, I suppose position and the missing part, whatever. But I've also seen that clutter can do that as well. And and so the way I work is that I lift the energy of the clutter, or I can send a boost of energy that helps to break down whatever you can't see, that is almost like solidifying everything. It's like a glue. That's fun, but just can't move. And once that's done, it feels a lot easier for some reason. Now, of course I can't explain it. But I haven't made any specific suggestion to my clients. I just said, let's try this and see if it works. And it seemed to have worked. So that's why I wanted to share that experience.

29:42
Yeah, exactly. I think sometimes you don't know what it is that takes somebody to that place where they suddenly get a burst of energy to want to go ahead and do something. It's hard. It's hard to kind of put into words sometimes, but sometimes it's empowerment. Sometimes it's validation. So there's lots of things like that, that that kind of happened where people are like, well, we talk a lot about light bulbs going on. So sometimes it's just about it's about education, you know. So it can be a whole manner of things that make people suddenly spark into action. But for you is this boost of energy, that's perhaps giving them the impetus to, to move forward. And anything that works in the decluttering world and gets you from a procrastination place into an action place is good in my eyes. So let's meet. And so

30:27
what is the way if you don't mind explained the way Reiki is supposed to work? And again, I'm gonna say suppose because I don't want to impose my beliefs on anyone else, is that it works at three levels, the physical, the mental, and the emotional. Okay, so the idea is, for people who know Reiki, there's three levels, and it doesn't really matter. It's not that one is better than the other. But at level two, you learn some symbols that you can apply to whatever even like a floorplan and the symbols, one of them is, it works with the physical, as I said, one with the emotional, mental, and then one is more like, into the past and into different places that are not directly where you are. So that's why it makes sense that it could have an impact on decluttering. Because depending on the symbols that you use, you can help with the physical energy or you can help with the mental. The mindset, because I'm sure you know, better than I do that the mindset is paramount in the decluttering journey, and the emotional as well we know how emotionally charged some objects can be or, or maybe it's because we feel shame and shame is a blocker. Shame stops us from even doing anything. So if in some way, we can shift that, and then they can help.

31:51
Absolutely. So if you're a complete novice, and Reiki and energy and have listened to this podcast and think I want to do a little bit of what I've just been doing, where would somebody go and find him? For more information about this kind of thing?

32:06
Was really finished, you should ask because I literally, and I know this episode's gonna come after it's published on my podcast, but I literally did an episode that's going to be released on the new check the date on the 19th of July about the five things you need to know about energy on my own podcast. Okay, and

32:26
what sort of that could be? What's your podcast called?

32:28
It's called True spirituality with Ange. Okay,

32:31
perfect.

32:34
AMG? Yeah. So it's so that will give you the basics of understanding, you know, how does this energy thing work, because I understand that you wouldn't know. And when I started off my journey, I didn't know either, for sure. But

32:48
it's that spark of it, it's that spark of interest. And that might, you know, people have tried many, many things to, to get themselves into a place where they're declutter their home. And this might, you know, ignite something in somebody, and people might like what they hear and think I'm gonna give that a go, you know, and that's, you know, but you need to know where to start with that, so and so that's the 19th of July. And we'll pop that into the show notes as well. And I already

33:13
have an episode on feng shui. So that explains a different version, then the the guests that you had before, that's also on the podcast already, where I explain a bit my journey with Feng Shui, what it did, how I understand it works and all that sort of thing. So that might help your your audience as well.

33:29
Fantastic. Thank you. And where can people find a little bit more? Obviously, you mentioned your podcast, where can people find out a little bit more about you? I'm

33:37
mostly active on LinkedIn, and Facebook. So LinkedIn is on stream. Yeah, which I'm hoping that somewhere, you'll have the spelling. So I don't bore people with spelling it on on air. My, my website is Anjali Mia dot this, and also on Facebook, I have a page called spiritual lawyer. So that's where people can find me. And obviously, on my podcast, that's the easiest way to find me. And

34:03
I know that you've got a special offer as well. So we'll pop that into the show notes as well for if anybody's interested in working directly with you. So we'll pop that into the show notes as well. And just so all that is left for me to say. So thank you so much. And for sharing your story with us. I really appreciate you allowing us to delve a little bit into your world and what's happened over the past few years with your energy with your children in particular and with your decluttering journey and all and how that's unfolded over the past few years. So it's been a fascinating insight into your world. Thank you so much for sharing. And, you know, goes to the shownotes find all about and and you'll also see you can she's in the Facebook group, right so you can pop into the Facebook group and ask her any questions that you might have. So thank you so much, and we will see you all next week.

34:49
Thank you for having me.

34:55
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