A photograph of author Caroline Rivka standing next to the APDO banner

Episode 46 – Author, Rivka Caroline, explains how she went from Frazzled to Focused

In this podcast, Ingrid talks to Rivka Caroline, author of Frazzled to Focused about her experience of organsing a family of 9.

Rivka is an English native now living in the Miami sunshine and has seven children. Three children in and she quickly realised she needed some systems in place when organising a family to retain her sanity. Rivka explains the 10 predictable and boring systems families need.

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Transcript of this podcast episode

Intro  0:07  
Welcome to today's episode of The declutter hub podcast, your channel for super easy, no nonsense advice on how to declutter and organise your home. Please welcome your host professional organisers, Ingrid Johnson and Lesley Spellman.

Ingrid  0:22  
Hello, and welcome listeners to Episode 46 of the declutter hub Podcast. I'm Ingrid. If you have clutter and want to sort it out, this is the show for you. In today's episode, we're talking to Rivka Caroline, owner of Sobey organised working in Miami, Florida. Rivka is an author, motivational speaker, an influential motivator and an expert in productivity and all things organised. Rivka is the author of From frazzled to focused, which was listed on the New York Times parenting blog at mother lode as a top 10 must read for parents. She also created the focus finder planner pad. Since earning her master's in psychology Rivka has taught hundreds of the business people in the universe how to make more time for what they love. Rivka loves the relationship between time management and positive psychology and firmly believes that it takes more effort to be disorganised than it does to be organised. I had the pleasure of hearing Rivka speak at the conference of the Association of Professional declutter organisers here in the UK, and I loved her practical tips for organising the disorganised family. Welcome to the show. Rivka 

Rivka  1:38  
Thank you. Thank you.

Ingrid  1:40  
It's lovely to have you here.

Rivka  1:41  
Lovely to be here.

Ingrid  1:43  
We first need to tell our listeners Where are where are we?

Rivka  1:46  
Okay, we are in Chigwell, Essex in a beautiful country garden, where I want to wait to every afternoon when I'm here in England with my family, and I'm so happy that we're here.

Ingrid  1:59  
Me too. And it's indeed it's one of the warmest days.

Rivka  2:03  
We are very positively sweating away.

Ingrid  2:06  
So if you hear any kind of trees rustling in the background, yeah, any other kind of country noises, then you understand that we're actually recording this outside. But we did a little test. And I think we're good on sound. So let's hope Rivka I'm delighted I'm talking to you today. And I can't wait to delve deeper into your practical tips. Because this podcast is all about keeping it real and giving our listeners advice they can put into action. So they feel less overwhelmed and more in control of their lives. But first, can you tell us a bit more about yourself and how you ended up writing a book?

Rivka  2:41  
Yes, absolutely. So I'm a mom of seven. And I know

Intro  2:45  
Yes, listeners. You did have to collect listeners right

Rivka  2:50  
now now that 10 Age 10 through 25. But 10 years ago they weren't. So basically when I had three children, I was very overwhelmed. That was a good 20 years ago. And believe it or not, this was the times before Google search and before podcast before Instagram before Facebook, can you imagine? And I didn't know how to run my home. I knew I wasn't lazy. But I didn't understand how all the mechanics fell into place. So I took myself to Barnes and Nobles back in the day. And I remember looking and looking for, you know, something like the mummy, the mums Guide to Running the home in a sensible and practical manner. And believe it or not, I couldn't find it. I found humorous books which were funny but I really wanted the nuts and bolts I found there was a big divide there was a business you know, any any business advice I wanted was right there on the bookshelves, but anything practical the meal planning all the bits all the all the boring and predictable that I talked about. I couldn't find it. So all I did is I took the business books and I translated it. So you know project management, it became middle management and instead of you know, this team member, it became you know, the oldest child and I kind of translated it for myself into efficient ways to run my home because I was busy, but I wasn't focused. Okay. And then, like anything else, once I found a rhythm to live my own life in a practical way. It kind of felt like someone who had the you know, the 90% of vouchers. I couldn't I couldn't help but start sharing it. And then you know, eventually you know, I started my career and I wrote the book. That's how it all started.

Ingrid  4:37  
So you're actually not a professional organiser but you are an organised person who wrote a book is it cannot or are you a professional?

Rivka  4:47  
or semi i don't know i love productivity. I love clever systems. I love to outsmart things I love things working while I love leaving the house when there are six machines going I love all of that. And I love saving people time very, very much. So I don't actually know what I call myself. I call myself a productivity expert.

Ingrid  5:09  
And one of the things you mentioned in your book as well is that you say, it takes more effort to be disorganised than it does to be organised. And how did you come to that conclusion?

Rivka  5:20  
Absolutely. So when I was deep in the trenches, myself, I was always busy. I was always overwhelmed. I never could sit on the couch, knowing that things were under control, there was always another fire to put out and I was exhausted from my own fires. Then when I got things together, and there was a predictability and a rhythm and the boring, stable systems, I was fully able to sit on the couch knowing that dinner was in the oven, the washing was in the washing machine, there was a method to my madness. And that's how I realised you know, I think honestly, I tell people, I'm not organised by nature, even though I have a great appreciation for being organised. I kind of am a big fan of later. I'll do it later. I'll do it later. Like a very well intentioned later wrist. But I think honestly, I think my love of sitting on the couch made me organised.

Ingrid  6:15  
So be truthful here. How many times? How much do you sit on the couch?

Rivka  6:20  
I like to because of my lovely systems, it's I try and make Wednesday, my home day, I tried. Because if I if I don't create a system, this you know, this is my big belief in general, if I don't make a system, it won't happen. So me sitting on the couch is never going to happen. But if Wednesday is a home day, or I haven't say phone clients, and I'm home, there is more chance that I will actually get to that wonderful couch with a book. Yeah, and a blanket.

Ingrid  6:46  
But in the end, that's what we all want the West.

Rivka  6:49  
That's what I want from my mom's so you know, when I see moms working so, so, so hard, I want that for them to really, really and truly comes down to the couch.

Ingrid  6:59  
So you thought about you wrote the book when you had three children, you had another four F

Rivka  7:07  
book with three ended the book with six. So the book must have taken about five years.

Ingrid  7:13  
So you're you're obviously using your advice because she I don't think I know anybody else. I mean, it used to be normal. I mean, my my mother is one of seven my my mother in law is one of 16 No, no, not Yeah. Why

Rivka  7:27  
aren't we interviewing? Those systems? Oh, six. Well, you know what? They say that the human memory can hold seven items. Remember everyone's name have to stop at seven.

Ingrid  7:40  
And you've got a grandchild, I had a

Rivka  7:41  
grandchild. Oh gratulations that is really the fun to add all the fun without any responsibility that talk about outsourcing.

Ingrid  7:52  
I'm sure you're done look. Now, let's go back to your book, because I really really enjoyed your book. I think it's it's excellent advice. I love all your your your humour in it as well. I think it's so funny. And I talking to you now I understand why your book is written the way it is because you're very humorous and fun person. So, but what I really liked about your book is the classic 10 systems and you call them predictable and boring. So boring. But I agree with you. I think you can declutter all you want and shopping and then decluttering. Again, organise it all. But if you don't have those systems in place, then you're going to end up keeping decluttering and organising. And being on there exactly. As

Rivka  8:44  
I say in my book, we don't get organised to get more organised, meaning somebody might say, Well, my, my cans are all organised. But if I have time, I'll put them in ABC order. And if I can, I'll colour code them. That's not being organised. That's a false sense of control. And that's where my psychology background really has helped me also, it's not about any of that people can drive themselves crazy. And I never make jokes. You know, some people say, Oh, I'm so OCD. I never say that because there's a real condition but some people really can get in over their heads in terms of organising. Yeah. What I, what I really felt, I still feel is that our grandmothers had it. They had this steady rhythm of running a home, they always knew what they were defrosting. They always knew when laundry day was they always knew when the deep cleaning was now don't get me wrong. I'm thrilled that we all get the choice to run businesses and do all we want. The thing is that I see mums so that's the you know the basis of my business as mums, incredibly burnt out. And I am a big believer of having our cake and eat it too. But sometimes the cake has to be bought sometimes the cake has to be preset sometimes the cake has to be frozen, but I don't want any mom driving home, whether from work or driving home from carpool, wondering what's for dinner? I really don't. Yeah,

Ingrid  10:10  
I agree. And I think a lot of people asking me the same thing. How come you're so organised, because I have all the systems in place. And because I really am a person that is practical and down to earth, I thought, you know, we can talk about the beautifully organised cabinets of that's, that's lovely, but I want to talk about these, these 10 systems that actually are going to help our listeners to get control of their lives. So I'm just gonna do

Rivka  10:37  
before we jump in, I want to say one thing to our listeners. Don't try and take on 10. Yeah, today, because what happens is, and it's really funny, my whole book I wrote so, so much, and the two pages that got the most attention was was the two pages on perfectionism. And I think we do have a silent epidemic going on. And so what I want to say to our listeners is choose one, choose one of the 10 conquer it, have it sustainable, so it takes 30 days to develop a new habit. Yeah. Okay. So if you're winging it after a week, and you're liberated, wonderful, go on to the next one. But I don't want any listener here say, Well, if I haven't got all 10 done by tomorrow, I'm a failure. Yeah.

Ingrid  11:16  
Good advice. So definitely take that on board listeners. So let's start with number one.

Rivka  11:22  
Number one meal plan meal planning. Okay. So here's the thing about meal planning, that's just terrible, is the children have to eat every day. Really again, and my mom say, I have no idea what to make. And I say to them, but you've made dinners for 10 years. Yeah. And it's really, you know, make me if you want to be spontaneous, have your weekend spontaneous, you've got more time, just get the kit on Monday, two thirds through Thursday, get the Monday through Friday taken care of think of things that your family has enjoyed even three things, three things, and then do something simple. Some families do take out either funding dental school, they've got takeout different genres, four nights a week, that you don't have to be good at everything. You know, now in the world of YouTube, if you are a bad cook, you can become a good enough Cook, it will take you seven minutes to learn a certain recipe. But the one thing that I asked moms not to do is make dinner into a perfect conquest of the perfect dinner and the perfectly balanced meal. That's you can if you want to take Wednesday's off and experiment at home, that's fine. But on a we need a good enough dinner plan. Good enough, if if you're a meat eater, it can be you know, chicken and sweet potatoes, like my children know this is going to be it forever. When you come home with the grandchildren, it will be the same dinner, you know, or if you're this is what's also hard with so individual. Some people say but if you make me boring, you're you're holding my hands, you're holding my hands my back, I say fine. Make money. If you're a meat eater, make Monday night's chicken or if you're not a metre, make, you know make it past at least you've narrowed down the decision making. Yeah, you know, and so some people will thrive on a predictable and boring routine, and others will thrive knowing that that's the genre. But what I say to mind is think of the part of the four favourite meals that children have enjoyed. And you can also ask the children, they will be your harshest critics. And if your children are very, very picky, you can do a three day meal plan and keep rotating. It could be that everyone will be very, very happy.

Ingrid  13:31  
Yeah. So do you make a meal plan before you like an evening before you go to the shops? And then you think right on Monday if chicken what what kind of chicken are we doing on Tuesday is beef? Right? And a Wednesday is faster? And

Rivka  13:46  
yes, very well. I have a basic rhythm or just a basic rhythm for our family. I know the list, I'm very boring. The children know that I'll do you know it's a chicken on a Monday. So it will be I'll just vary the sources. It will be with sweet potatoes or potatoes or whatever. They'll always be a soup, because I can throw them in a suit makers. It's very, very simple. It's very, very simple. There'll be rice in the rice cooker or quinoa rice cooker and it just flows and then that way. If someone's like, oh, I don't want chicken, there's no drama. I think that was a big quest to find also just the drama free living, no problem have a sandwich with soup. No problem. Yeah, you know, I think life throws enough drama at us. It's our job to try and kind of.

Ingrid  14:23  
So basically what we're trying to achieve with a meal plan is to prevent asking yourself at five to six when everybody's hungry.

Rivka  14:32  
Including mom herself. Yeah. How can we and this is something that I just came up with myself. How can we respond and not react when we're starving? You know, they say calling America hangry you know?

Ingrid  14:45  
So people who know me are laughing now in their cars or wherever they're listening to this podcast, because I am I am absolutely the example of Hangouts not sure I can when I'm angry but second angry. Yeah, no,

Rivka  14:59  
it 100% True. So it's about also practically speaking listeners right now, take a bottle of a tissue box, right, the four dinners that your children enjoyed that were not crazy to make, okay, you don't have to stop bulk freezing, just write it down on a piece of back of that tissue box or a piece of paper, and stick it on your fridge. I think a big part of these systems also is getting things out of mom's brain, we carry so much information, it's unfair. Put it on a piece of paper, make sure it looks good, make sure it's doable. And then create your shopping list. And that completes your weak one. And then practice for a week and see some families will feel so liberated. They'll want that again and again. And again. Other firms will say Oh, Mom, can you please not make sweet and sour chicken again? Oh, sure. I'll make apricot chicken no problem. You know, you can have your variety, and it's so personal. And then I hear the mums saying, I love to make a lovely dinner. Wonderful. That's what that's your Wednesday, choose a day for you to experiment. But don't do. But if you've got a choice put experimenting, or taking care of yourself or doing that yoga class you've been telling yourself you'll do for five years. Just question just question how important that meal is.

Ingrid  16:13  
And also, I think, if you do decide that Wednesday is to experiment in the fancy dinner day, don't come running in from a club with your kids at five at 530. If you want to have dinner at 600%. That's not gonna work. So if you actually think a fancy dinner is a lot more time to prepare, maybe you need to move that to the weekend and have a takeaway you normally have on a Saturday morning or Wednesday because it works better.

Rivka  16:38  
Yes, if you've got experiment day, then at least have something in the freezer as backup, you know, and then you might say, Oh, I will go to coffee for with a friend. And that actually is what I want our moms to do. Take care of yourself. Yeah, you know, so it's all I like, I always like to have options. Good.

Ingrid  16:56  
You mentioned shopping. Yeah. And so of course that's connected you can we talk about shopping plans. salutely.

Rivka  17:03  
And I'm a big fan of England English shops because you have wonderful delivery services. And I just want to take a moment and mums. If you love, love, love shopping, don't listen to this part. Okay, we'll come back into come back in two minutes. Please understand that shopping is an incredible amount of energy. Okay, you get out of your car, you take your shopping trolley, you put everything that you need in the trolley from the trolley to the checkout from the checkout back the trolley the trolley into the car car into the house. So that item has been moved four or five times. Yeah. Okay, so I just asked you to think if you would consider getting any of the home deliveries because that's an hour of your time you know, and for some months that's the difference between that couch time and not couch time you know in America actually costs more here the price is the same. So I would urge listeners to consider that if you love love shopping, maybe you can actually do the shopping every other week yourself some you know try and get beyond that I just need to choose my own tomato stage personal bag

Ingrid  18:07  
I do want to pick my own tomato but I've outsourced it to my husband

Rivka  18:12  
wonderful. Oh you know what you know what you might you know what you might do? I've done going to Costco I am done I don't do for 20 years I graduated I retired from Costco. But every once in a while I'll run in for one or two items very very big difference between running in for one or two items and picking up 30 items. So mom's if you're able to outsource the boring of toilet paper all the other bits that you don't have to you know pick up five times and then just pop in for something very very big difference. But yes shopping plans should be on the computer or if you're a paper and pen person paper and pen or whatever you want. But you should be editing it you shouldn't be thinking you should you know whenever you're shopping day is look at your lists and just go through it and that's actually another advantage of shopping online they will keep your favourites yes you know so and that also you can actually save money that way which is always a nice bonus where you see that your favourite items on sale you can buy 10 somebody else's is bringing it to the house. So the shopping plans you should know when you go you should know what you're going with. And you should consider deliveries home deliveries at least every other week if you really don't want that but that to me is an easy way to get that one hour and

Ingrid  19:22  
yeah. And if you would go to the shops where do you take your list with you have you got a standardised list? That you take the items that you need.

Rivka  19:30  
Yes I knock knock. The company has a very nice on their website. I believe they have just a template of a generic shopping list. My children once saw it they checked off everything is there. No, no, no. That's not what will jog my memory. I'll actually use Google Keep to keep a running list of what I you know what I need. I don't go shopping that often anymore if I do now, now that I'm in England, I get up early and I go to Costco and I work and I pop into Waitrose I always pick up six or seven items for the home and I will write them down Only because, and this was Julie Morgenstern, the big organiser in America, somebody asked her Do you write everything down to just write down the things I want to remember? You know, so I do. And that's again, that goes back to, it takes more effort to be, or to be disorganised. It takes more effort for me to go shopping without a list, because I know I'm forgetting something, but I just can't quite pinpoint what it is.

Ingrid  20:20  
Yeah. Let's move on to laundry.

Rivka  20:24  
Absolutely. Absolutely. And that's a big question I get I'm sure you get that a lot. Yeah. The thing with laundry is it's very personalised, some people love it, when the cleaning cleaning lady does it and doesn't want to think don't want to think about it. Some people don't have clean leaders. Some people if I've got a friend who's a full time teacher, Sunday, she washes everything, and she uses stain remover during the week. Other people like myself, I like to throw a load on in the morning. Yeah, I think it's just I honestly, I just like, I'd like everything whizzing in the morning. I'm a morning person, I just like it was saying, you really have to work out what you do. And I'm actually for any families here that have more than three children, please don't throw everything together and wash it all. And then sort it, I bet your mother in law never did that, you know, throw 16 children's stuff together, because then you're not laundering you're sorting. And I have a nice anecdote that I'm quite proud of, in my book, where I say to anyone who wants to throw all the laundry together, just next time you go shopping, go to the lady in front of you, and just merge all of your shopping together, and then go after you've both paid and work out who's shopping is who and who owes who, what. And that is the same when you throw everyone if you're a family of three children out and up and you throw five people's laundry together, you're going to spend a minut amount of time washing and a large amount of time sorting. So laundry is for laundering. So I just laundry been in every room. I'm a big believer in subblocks, I don't know what they're called over here. But I buy them on eBay, their little plastic circles that are joined together that I put the socks in. Otherwise, you will spend something like 200 pounds a year on lost socks. And even if they were sold in gold, I would probably buy them. And it's really about making a plan sticking to it. And then trying you're what I what I've done over time as children have, you know, left the house and things have changed. just written it, let's put it on the washing machine and just try and see if it works. Yeah, you know, it's like all those systems, you try something. And sometimes it's not as practical in the concrete as it is in the abstract. But throwing a load on in the morning and then just folding it while it's warm. I love to have the children do that task. I think it's a very, very good learning curve for them that laundry doesn't just magically come back into the cupboard again. But that's something that everyone's different. But whatever plan you you devise, stick to it.

Ingrid  22:40  
Yeah, I think laundry is actually quite complex, because of course, it's clean people wear it, it's then half worn or it's dirty. And then if it's dirty, is it white? Is it dark? Is it that it needs to be washed and hot or not. And so there's so many things and then of course, it has to be hung out, it needs to be dried, it needs to be folded, it needs to be possibly ironed before it all comes back. So you really want to make the flow as easy as possible. Because otherwise, you get in a hole tense about it. Absolutely.

Rivka  23:10  
Absolutely my children. We don't really iron that much. It's Miami, I can hang things outside if I need to, you know, I'll use the drive a little bit more than I would like to. But generally speaking, the boys stuff just it just it flows, it flows.

Ingrid  23:26  
One thing listeners, if you have real struggles with laundry, don't keep buying more underwear and more socks because you just create more problems for yourself. And I've seen it happen in England, the laundry is such a mess and a nightmare. So I've gone out and bought another 10 pack of underwear or another 10 packs of socks. Yes, because at least we've got clean now. But that comes dirty and gets lost again and before you know you're looking at mountains close. And I've seen that. And that's that's very problematic. So you really not.

Rivka  23:58  
It's very hard.

Ingrid  23:59  
So a system is super important. And I'm like you I like to put a load in the morning in the washing machine before I leave. And it runs while I'm away. And when I get in, I hang it up and then I'm like yes, this it flows.

Rivka  24:10  
It flows. Like some other people who aren't morning people that would be torturous. Yeah, you know, and then and they would happily give up a different day. And just do laundry. Yeah.

Ingrid  24:20  
A morning plan right? Sure. Next Yeah, predictable boring system right

Rivka  24:26  
so there's two is it's it's a two phase morning plan. The first is what the children need to get up and out. And then if Mum all moms or working moms, but does mum have to leave at that exact moment? I leave with the children. So everything has to flow from that. So what what basically I try to tell moms when it's it's common sense is the morning starts the night before. Then really, my goal in the morning is to get my children into the car feeling loved. I won't do long dri if there's four minutes left and it's gonna make me crazy, yeah, you know, generally I am a morning person so I'm lucky in that regard you know things flow Sundays I get snacks ready ahead of time. Even if I put you know when I'm putting dinner are preset my oven it's already frosted it's ready the morning is, is it's quite simple because it's been done it's about breakfast, there's no running around with lost items because my children don't get to play on their devices at night if they're not ready to go the next morning. And it's you know, I've got my own wardrobe is very boring like we love. There's no drama that I buy extra. This is one thing I would say to mums. Listening I know it's the summertime, you know, this is at school years behind us. But before we sneeze, it's going to be back, do buy extra uniforms. Even if you keep them in the packet and buy one size larger and keep it in the packet. You don't ever want to be running around in the morning when the when you know the laundry system is tweaking or this happened or that happened or someone spills out down their blouse in the morning, you know have have extra because it's a little bit extra money. But I pretty much can assure you that one day a year you will be so happy that you have extra on hand. Yeah. Does that resonate? Yeah,

Ingrid  26:13  
I've got my son as five pairs of trousers and like five exact shirts. And he doesn't wear a fresh pair every day. Exactly. So I can cover about two weeks in between the washing and drying and ironing. Yeah, so I have always extra because otherwise, I don't want to be ripping this clothes off them. As soon as they come home. We go I need to wash this now. And

Rivka  26:37  
ya know, I've been in that regard. And it took me a while to get to five because I was like, oh, that's silly. That's so superfluous. You know, I live in Miami. But I have an English background. And I'm quite sensible. But I got to the point. I guess I've made enough mistakes. That's what makes you an expert. Where it's not worth it. You know, if someone spills cereal that if they spilled cereal down their blouse, that's exactly what they're meant to be there. And this is another point for the listeners that took me a while to learn. They're the children. You're the adult. You're the adult you're, you know, you're not a magician, but you should allow for the children being children. It's not a case of a Why are you so clumsy their children? Yeah, yeah. And even if mom spills her cereal down, it's okay. Yeah, you know, but what I'm trying to say is, it's I guess that is the difference between running a business and running a home is that there's just so much more human error that we want to account for. And it's not a big deal.

Ingrid  27:28  
Yeah. Yeah. Very good. So leaving home loved ready to go and hopefully with some breakfast in them, if possible. And then that's the Morning plan. Of course, the next one is one of my favourite ones clear and clean. No, I do love cleaning. You notice listeners. Thank God, thank goodness, I have a cleaning ladies that lovely clean there to help me keep my home clean. And I'm very lucky. Definitely. But I don't mind cleaning it all myself, I just don't have enough time. So now I love so why it's so important to have a clear and clean.

Rivka  28:00  
And it's it's not easy anymore. It's not easy. When we grew up. There were two kids, I don't remember stuff that we are now living in the age of stuff. There are clearance aisles, there's 80% of this, this buy one get two free, you know, I can only pick out the map. You know, we've got we're living in a, you know, in an age of stuff. And I think it's just because of circumstances many of us associate stuff and an abundance with comfort. And it's really the opposite. We need less less stuff, Mote and this this sounds very harsh, but most of us could give away 80% of what we own. And not only not miss that those items actually feel quite relieved. So the first step and you know this before we can clean is to get rid of stuff. I leave rubbish bags, boxes, you know, I'll hang one practical tone, you can hang a rubbish bag over a hanger, right there in the cupboard, and put things in that you don't love, love, love Keep, keep giving things away. And what I found is that the more you give away, the more you realise with some some embarrassment, how they would should never really have been bought in the first place. Most of the items that we buy, really didn't need to be bought. So the first stage is just realising that all this stuff is living rent free in your home, you're taking care of it. Second, stop buying things. I'm sure I know I have clients this way. And I'm sure you do too, where they just say, I just don't know how it gets in. And you say but but you're buying so less stuff, less stuff. And then and this is hard. And this is where the professional organisers can come in, is everything should have a home. Everything should have a home so there's not just stuff laid around. And then you want a time, a time to organise. So if you're rushing out in the morning, that's an Not the time, maybe that's the weekend. Maybe that's the evening. Everyone's so different. But it's very important to have a time to put things in place. Use your children, children are there. And it's not they're not only the cheapest form of labour, it's so good for them. It's so good for them to put things back in place your daughter and sons in laws will love you if you don't raise a slob. We're not doing them any favours. Yeah. By cuddling them, let them know where things go. Yeah.

Ingrid  30:28  
Yeah. I think also, very importantly, when you've got a clear home, it's so much easier to clean. Because then your whole daily routine gets easier weekly routine gets easier and we've got so on the declutter on the declutter hub.com website, we've got some cleaning lists and weekly cleaning and daily cleaning among those I'm gonna look them up I'm always asked. Yeah, because you don't have to do did clean your windows every week. That's, that's, that's nonsense, right. But there is stuff you need to do daily, and there's stuff you need to do weekly. And if you start with those, your whole life Absolutely.

Rivka  31:04  
is formed. Think of it like a fridge. If your fridges so crammed full of stuff. I mean that that's a blessing. Don't get me wrong, but just practically, you can't get in there to clean it. If your house is full of stuff. How can you go through the mechanics? And yes, an empty home is wonderful to clean but also at another gift, which may be you know, even greater as you can think and your own home, which we want. We want our homes to be this hub, this cocoon of safety, we come back to reboot and then go face the world again. We don't want our homes to overwhelm us. Yeah, that's what life's for. Homes are to keep us safe. Yeah. And also the children. You know, children also do deserve to be brought up in a home that has that have rhythms and have just a feeling of safety and pile. Of course, a pile here and a pile there. Nothing's going to happen. But if children can't find their shoes in the morning, it's not really fair. Yeah, not really. Yeah,

Ingrid  32:02  
I agree. And I think everybody feels a lot happier when you're not frantically every morning running around trying to find where's my shoes, where's my backpack where the gear is, where's the absolute, it's just so chaotic. And it rains, the energy you use, you haven't even started your day and you're in a muddle. And it's the same when daily, you need to load the dishwasher. So that also means daily, you need to unload it. So you're ready for the next day to have it loaded again. Absolutely. And if you start to do those things, those couple of things every day. You you you see an improvement in your whole time and timekeeping and you're absolutely scheduling.

Rivka  32:41  
You know what I tell some mums I don't have a closing ceremony at night, not at 10 o'clock at night when you're we're all bamboozled. At 637 o'clock, just and you can write this down. Some of us by the end of the day, I know myself, I can't think straight, I just need a list. You know, you know, different children will take turns clearing off the dinner table. And then I'll load the dishwasher or defrost dinner for the next you know the protein for the next night or whatever it is her write those things down. You don't have to be Wonder Woman, Wonder Woman has lists, you know, write that have a closing, closing ceremony. And sometimes what I tell moms, some mums tell me it takes me so long to close. So set your timer for 30 minutes. Get through as much as you can, and then call it a day.

Ingrid  33:25  
So yeah, let's so let's talk about his evening schedule. I'm stepping a bit ahead. But it's all right. Let's talk about his evening schedule. So what do you do in the evening, besides tidying up after dinner? Did thinking about dinner the next day, she needs you for something? What else is what else?

Rivka  33:39  
What else on the list? Let me think so I will tidy up my car because like many moms, I spend more time in my car than my house. I tidy up my car. And this is in a relaxed mode. Yeah, the children will have homework. Yeah, the children get their uniforms ready for the next day. They'll bring in their lunch boxes, they'll get their lunch ready for the next day. It's a general relaxed atmosphere. I try and talk to each child for about 10 minutes by themselves whether it's out in the garden together or they come clean the car Tell me about your day I try very very much to it's very difficult to I try to because I want to hear about their day because sometimes children will keep things on their mind and their heart without telling you and you find out two weeks later and you feel so bad that you didn't know also in the evenings and this is a big topic I'm sure you could actually do a whole podcast on its own minimise iPhone time for myself minimise phone time, you know now with WhatsApp and the voice notes so I would say two thirds of thing items, I would usually get an email I now get as a WhatsApp. And while I'm really good about only checking my email in the morning WhatsApp is constantly there and it's interesting. So in the evenings my phone is off. I just have to be present with the children. I will let them go on devices when they've done their homework to relax I don't mind for a short while because all their friends are on it gets so dramatic. Yeah. So I don't mind using it as an incentive, 1520 minutes. And then I try and read stories to anybody who will still allow me to. I'll see. I'll see what's going on who needs what the gym uniform that this that the evenings are quite boring. I've really minimise the after school activities. It's too much it's too chaotic. It's not enjoyable. Yeah, I know, it's, you know, I think mums are slowly going in that direction, where it's not about driving them to different activities every night of the week. It's too much. You know, I say to moms, choose one choose two that are life changing that they love. That's good for them. But I feel like children just need to be off. You know, in the garden, relaxing, reading, just being recharging. Yeah, you know, so that's what an evening looks like. Very boring.

Ingrid  35:58  
Yeah. Yeah, but I mean, if that way you can get your your because you do a lot of prep for the day after

Rivka  36:06  
prep for the day ahead in a calm and relaxed manner. So if I'm getting things ready for dinner for the next day, the kids can chop with me or my girls know how to put lentil soup in the crockpot they'll, you know, soak the lentils, whatever it is, it's just a, it's just a rhythm. And I do sometimes go out with a friend. Once every few weeks, the children like oh my goodness, really. But um, but generally speaking, the evenings are just a bit of a lull. Yeah,

Ingrid  36:33  
yeah. And recharging the batteries. Yeah. Another one of your systems is a way for children to communicate homework.

Rivka  36:44  
That's so dramatic. What does that mean? It just means that if there's a project due next Thursday, could you please tell me and I have a, I have a paper calendar, a family paper calendar, I just love paper. And the children have their own calendars, you know, next to their desks. And it will you know, some of it depends on their style. Some like paper, some like the dry erase board doesn't matter. But I must know when there's a project, I must know. Because sometimes, and this is hideous, they have to be driven to friends houses to do the project, which I think you know, defeats everything. But whatever it supplies, what do you need? Because, again, I don't want to be surprised and have that drama. No.

Ingrid  37:31  
So you instil to them from a young age? Definitely, there's a project do you need to tell me you need to tell me you can't tell me the night before that you need wi labour for tomorrow? You

Rivka  37:41  
can, but you're taking a big risk. If it's in the house, you can have it I'm not going to punish you. But you're winging it. Yeah. You know, and I don't keep an abundance of supplies. Yeah, you know, I've seen this with, with my older children. It's funny because now, you know, my house is a lab, as I've said, you know, so I see that my married boys, both sent out the thank you cards right away, you know, they just know what's on the list. Let's get it done. Or my daughter, you know, my teenager will quickly order things to get delivered to the house. It's like, Well, you told me to always throw money at stress, and oh, my God, you made the stories. But it's I see this I see this way and and the children do. Like my one of my children went to overnight camp this summer. And she knew from last year, if she packs a week early, she has no stress. And she wanted that again this year. So I think, you know, it's a mixture of wanting the family rhythm to flow a certain way and also to instil in them those values, so it's easier for them to run their lives.

Ingrid  38:42  
Yeah. And I think it's the same with and that's the next thing as well. No school supplies. You know, it's we're doing it now, but It's summer now they're going to start back up in September here in the UK. So we're now looking at okay, what what do we need to make sure that you have these for the summer? Absolutely.

Rivka  38:59  
school supplies are a hot item. I keep pencils on hand. With my older children. I used to make them responsible for their pencils. I think it was a bit harsh, you know, now as they get out the car, I hand them a pencil. Because why not? Maybe I'm a bit softer. That is the bottom three. But it I think it just starts their day off. They're not fumbling for a pencil, you know, school supplies. I will you know, I follow the lists. It's barbaric. I will load up on some especially if that's like 90% off sale. Yeah, that's good clutter. I'll keep it I won't buy 100 of something. What I this is a tip that parents might like when I see a 90% off sale on school supplies. This is what I did last year I was in a shop called target that is just wonderful. You're lucky you don't have it here just because it's so hard to resist. And as it happened, I walked into the aisle just as they were reducing really good notebooks for school down by 90% and that it's called Five stars. Just a great quality And I literally bought the shelf of it because they were like nine pence cents. Yeah. And I just donated them to school kept 10 For myself, and I spent like nine pounds being a wonderful person. So there is sometimes a way to buy the clearance items and not carry them in your house for 10 years. Yeah, you know, sometimes we want to, you know, it's just so much fun when you get those deals. So buy it, give it away, you know, but yeah, school supplies. I will keep enough but not tonnes.

Unknown Speaker  40:29  
Yeah. Yeah. But yeah, the children

Rivka  40:30  
have to know.

Ingrid  40:32  
And probably all in the same place, right? Yes. Not Not a question. No. And that's exactly what I'm trying to hopefully, share with my clients as well. Let's not have pens and paper and notepads. And being in 12 different places. Let's create one cupboards, one cupboard, where it all lives. Wonderful. So if you actually need to find something, or you if something is run out, you know, there's one place to go and look for it. If it's not there, you're gonna probably have to buy something new, wonderful. But if you've got everything everywhere, so you don't know what

Rivka  41:05  
happened absolutely,

Ingrid  41:07  
absolutely hard.

Rivka  41:08  
You know what I say in my book that I there's a line that I like, it's all about retrieval. If you if you have 10 bottles of glue somewhere, you really don't have them. If you don't know where it is better to have three in that cupboard you're talking about than 10 dots around it, nobody can find.

Ingrid  41:22  
Yeah, yeah. And I think then you also lose a lot of money. Because yeah, then you have to keep buying it over and over and over again.

Rivka  41:31  
Absolutely. And it's, you know, I'm getting more financially aware now that my kids are a bit older before I would just, you know, for me, what was more important than than spending money was losing sanity, because it was just, I was so outnumbered. Yeah. And now I'm looking more. And it makes so much more sense to buy things on sale, put them in a container, have it labelled or not just have a transparent container, and know where things are. I'm really, really becoming much more of a follower of that. Yeah. And also, what I would tell moms, is see which supplies the kids use again, and again, and again, what I did this year, and I'm 25 years into parenting, I bought on sale, of course, like a pack of 20 salad tapes, because everyone was always asking, and I just made a really pretty bowl, because from Ikea, and I just filled it with seller tips. And the children just knew where to go facilitate. Nobody asked me the whole year was on tape was, but what I would say to yourself is designate a space and when that space is up, it's up. Yeah, you know, and and if you've made a mistake and bought some folders that were on sale, or whatever, you can always donate them and fill that space with markers or tips. However it is, you know, just because you bought something once doesn't mean it stuck forever.

Ingrid  42:37  
Yeah, yeah. The next one I really am intrigued about was parents CEO time, yes, as one of your boring system. Like I said, maybe it's it's very important,

Rivka  42:47  
I think, I mean, I just find that aside from running my business running, not the home, just the children, just, you know, just all their appointments, and everything is does just involve time. So my first half an hour of work time will be about the children, who needs what you know, who needs new shoes, who who this who's got an appointment, I have to make which forms are missing, you know, now there's all the paper, there's so many forms that children need. And if I can, if I write it down the minute I think of it in my in my focus binder. And if there's just be a list of what the next things that children need, I'll do half an hour, I really need it over half an hour a day to do that. And I think it makes it much easier. Otherwise, you're filling out, you know, Camp forms haphazardly, and you're forgetting things and like you say about saving money. If you do the form, when you get in, you get the early bird special, it's more sensible, you know, any of these systems, you know, just to try and sell the boring. Another it's true, you do save money, because if you know you've got chicken every Monday night back to our meal plans, you can buy the family pack and freeze half. And if you know where your supplies go, you can buy the big pack of pencils, because you know that the children take every day. And the same with all their their forms. And appointments. You can get the bet, you know, let's say you've got appointments that you need after the summer, you can get the best appointment that you want now the exact time and the exact day that you want if you book it a month ahead. Yeah, you know, so I do run and that came back to the book that I ended up writing for myself was it really is a mini business. Yeah. You know, I don't want the dentist appointment at that. You know, when I booked the day before, you know, I want it. I know

Ingrid  44:28  
what made me laugh out loud. Absolutely. Is that when you said kids have so many body parts

Rivka  44:35  
through just stuff and it's funny with the fingernails now they all cut their own but I remember you know that I used to cut fingernails on a Sunday and whoever was it within shouting distance didn't get cut that week. So my friends would say someone's Oh dear, I guess somebody was busy outside on Sunday. You know, just there's so many bits you know, just the dental checkups and the well checkups and this and that. I just find that if I put in obviously I have more children but even if somebody's mother with less children, twice a one hour a week just sits down all the forms that this the research that you know, they want to do gymnastics, but where and how, you know, just those types of things. If you formulate it into a list with a fixed time, it becomes manageable.

Ingrid  45:16  
Yeah. Yeah. We discussed evening schedule. So that is done. The last one you say is quality time, children? Yes,

Rivka  45:25  
I think that sometimes, and I know I've been guilty of this, children are things that have to be fed and bathed and kept safe. But we don't often get to spend time with them. We don't get always time to parent them, which ironically, is our job. You know, you know, that's another podcast that you could just do on on parenting. And to me, it's being with a child. There's different ways to you know, and your way of spending time might not be their way, some children just wants to talk to you. And I know if I'm busy in the kitchen, the last thing I want is someone telling me about their day, if I'm trying to remember what I'm making, you know, but just to talk to them, Go for a walk around the block is very nice side by side, just just and just let them say what's on their mind, you will be amazed some children don't want to go for a walk. So one of my children, I go for a carwash with because they like just to go you know, a drive through car wash. Wonderful. Yeah, you know, phones away, and you're just listening, some children and colour with they love to colour with you. It doesn't have to be forever. At 1015 minutes. Yeah, you know, the more often than not, I don't parent when I'm grouchy, you know that hangry we spoke about, if I'm in that zone, where I'm just done, I've had a hard day or a client just took all my patients. I will be gracious, I will be wonderful. But I will not put myself in that zone. You know, you have to know. But I do think it's something that many of us miss out myself included in my earlier years. Just because sometimes, you know, I hope my children is sometimes it feels like children are sent to check off your list fed. Yeah, oh, macdon teeth brushed off, you know, and there are some nights that I that's all I can manage. You know, and there are other nights where I can go around the block. That's where if you've got a dog, it's wonderful. It's a built in, built in excuse, but it's that thing. It's not about their projects, their uniform, their nails, their breakfast, their teeth, their appointment is about them, seeing them, not as a buddy. You know, I tell my son often I'm not your friend, I'm your mummy, you've only got one mummy, but just to connect with them, because how can you effectively parent if you're not connected? Yeah,

Ingrid  47:31  
yeah, I know, parenting is I think the hardest thing and I would

Rivka  47:35  
never get a parenting class until my kids are about 50 years old and everyone's gone through.

Ingrid  47:42  
Yeah, well, maybe I think and I think all the systems actually create that it sounds a bit crazy. Like we're telling you to have all these systems. But the funny thing is, when you start to implement these systems one by one, and you find out that they're working, you actually do get more time

Rivka  47:59  
not a question that goes back to what we said the beginning about it taking more effort to be disorganised. Yeah, if you're running around ragged and worrying, what's for dinner on where are the children's shoes? And why didn't I buy enough blouses? And why have you got a project tomorrow, not telling me you're living in that reactive zone we spoke about, which is fine. That's how I started my whole career. You just don't want to live in it forever. You know, and if there are mums out here, who don't have any of these 10 in place, you're in a wonderful position. I was there. I was there you are in a wonderful, wonderful position. Just like we said, Take on one, take on one you will save time you'll save sanity you'll save money, you'll save everything, you know, it's and if it was simple, you would be doing it already. It takes time sometimes to do it one way to realise this may have worked with one kid but it's not working with two kids or this would have worked if my child was a different personality. You know, so you know it does take thinking and planning but yes these these plans will say set mums free. Yeah, I believe

Ingrid  49:00  
if people want to read your book Rivka how can they

Rivka  49:04  
how lovely thank you so on Amazon Yeah, Amazon frazzled too focused.

Ingrid  49:08  
So if you're interested in red because book go to Amazon and type in from frazzled to focus

Rivka  49:14  
and also my focus finder, my paper planner pad that it is an experimental run off 250 And they sawed off and I'm I am this summer I am getting it back up and running. Anybody who wants to hear more about that if they just go to my website, so be organised but I'm from America now. So it's worth a Zed and you sign up there for the email. I'll be sure to let everyone know when the focus Finders are on sale.

Ingrid  49:38  
Listeners we will put all these links as well in the show notes. So if you and on the website as well, we always have to focus on the website, Declutter. hub.com So if you want to know more about Rivka you can definitely find out more about her and about the book and about the planner. So that's it for this episode. listeners. We hope you've all enjoyed listening are inspired to take action Thanks so much for being our guest. So welcome. And I've loved talking to you and finding out more about your 10 predictable but every family needs. Listeners, I hope you've learned a lot as well today and request examples will be helpful for you, and you can implement them in your own home. Like I said, if you'd like to know more about Rivka we will post a link in the show notes along all her website details. Thanks so much for listening today today, and we'll see you next time.

Outro  50:32  
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FROM FRAZZLED TO FOCUSED – A GUEST BLOG BY RIVKA CAROLINE

Rivka Caroline is a Miami-based Professional Organiser and Mum to 7 (yes 7!) children. She is a big believer that it is so much easier being organised than disorganised when parenting.

Rivka explains the highlights of what she has learnt in decades of parenting.

In my opinion, having a family is a fabulous long term investment, however as a veteran Mum I can firmly attest that there are some times when I was one temper tantrum (mine not theirs) away from putting myself in time out.

Behind every sunny photo of a smiley, shiny, coordinated family are way more photos of runny noses, last minute school projects, failed dinners and late night google searches of "how to not ruin my child".

I want to encourage you all to go back to basics to create sensible systems that will support you at home in your parenting endeavours.

There's no such thing as a normal family

Parents I meet often share secret fears that their home is the most disorganised or their children the least well fed. There seems to be a secret conspiracy in the sleep deprived brains of parents that they are ‘less than’. I try and support them in any way I can to reassure them they are doing some things really well and help create simple systems for the other areas. I back this up with research from prominent family researcher, Froma Walsh, that there are no normal families. To add to the challenges coming at us, there are also challenges to our parenting from within. Contrary to what instagram would want you to believe, no one actually has a perfect life. With the lack of the nuclear family, the rise of special needs children, the breakdown of marriages, the challenges we weave into our private lives are real. To quote Froma Walsh, "Us researchers tried to find a normal family to base our research on but alas we couldn’t find one."

Helplessness leads to hopelessness

To retain my own personal sanity I have combined my 25 years of psychological study with my home ‘lab’ of child rearing to hone in on my personal ‘aha’ moments of nature vs nurture and what corners can be cut without long term ramifications!

Here is my one liner: too much stuff, too many decisions, too much responsibility leads to helplessness leading to hopelessness.

What do the researchers say?

Dr Barry Schwartz :The Paradox of Choice : The more choices we have the more chance there is of paralysis by analysis. Bring more sanity into your life by creating systems to minimise decision making and when you do have to make a choice give yourself only 2.

Dr Mikael S : The best moments in our lives are not the passive, receptive, relaxing times. The best moments usually occur if a person’s body or mind is stretched to its limits in a voluntary effort to accomplish something difficult and worthwhile. Everyone needs flow in their lives - a hobby, job or moment when time stands still and you are truly in the moment. When parents take time for what they love, they are filling up their ‘flow’ tank and will be happier, calmer, less reactive parents and vice versa.

Dr Martin Seligman : Chronic cases of negative thinking about ourselves, our homes and what we do can lead to learned helplessness which mimics biological depression. The good news is that optimism can also be learned and it’s not hard and extremely rewarding. Learned optimism is done by consciously challenging any negative self talk.

Living life with true focus is not easy

For most people and especially parents, living a focused life is a full time up stream vocation. The changes in the challenges we face since the invention of the iPhone are real.

Disrupting the industry of busy

In my opinion it’s not about keeping up, it’s about disrupting the industry of ‘busy’ and going back to basics. It means running the mechanics of our homes like stable businesses with smart systems that can be fixed and forgotten. Most families yearn for the old style predictability of stable home life and old school parenting but don’t know how to ‘actionise’ it.

10 predictable and boring systems families need

1
Meal plans
2
Shopping plans
3
Laundry plans
4
A morning plan
5
A clear and clean home plan
6
Away for children can communicate homework deadlines
7
A way for children to communicate necessary school supplies
8
Parent CEO time
9
Evening schedule
10
Quality time with children

It's good to follow these basic principles to create some level or order. But be prepared to embrace the chaos too - a home with children playing is never going to be minimal or tranquil!

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