A graphic of some files and messy piles of paperwork on a desk
Episode 15 – How long do you need to keep paperwork and bank statements?

In this episode, Lesley and Ingrid discuss the different categories of paperwork and for how long we should keep them. One of the most asked questions we get asked is how long do you need to keep paperwork and bank statements? People are reluctant to shred or recycle documents because they think they might need it someday. There is no right or wrong way as long as it's all organised and you can find it when you need it.
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Transcript of this podcast episode
Intro  0:07  
Welcome to today's episode of The Declutter Hub Podcast, your channel for super easy, no nonsense advice on how to declutter and organise your home. Please welcome your host professional organisers, Ingrid Jansen and Lesley Spellman.

Ingrid  0:28  
Hello, and welcome listeners to Episode 15 of the Declutter Hub Podcast.

Lesley  0:33  
I'm Ingrid. And I'm Lesley.

Ingrid  0:36  
If you have clutter and want to sort it out, this is the show for you. In today's episode, Lesley and I are talking all about paperwork. And we are going to talk about how long do you need to keep your paperwork for? Now, this is always a very big question that everybody asks all the time. And oh, how about you, Lesley, that my clients asked me all the time to me, How long do I need to keep this piece of paperwork for? So that's why we decided to do a podcast about it. So what do you think?

Lesley  1:08  
Well, first of all, I think that paperwork is my absolute favourite thing to declutter. I think it's yours to, like, little excited yourself. It's podcast. But yeah, I think it's, I think the first thing that we need to say is, there's no hard and fast rules about how long to keep anything. And so what I always say is, it's everything is about your own situation at home, you know, depending on what kind of family you've got. Are you on your own? Have you got kids? Are you have you got medical issues? Have you, there's so many things that come into play, when deciding what sort of things that you need to keep? Have you had anything complicated going on the life with council tax band, and having you know, there's so many things that are going to take you slightly off the norm. So what we're going to talk about today, I think we're going to go through things we're not what we're not here to do is advice. And I think the most important thing for us to say is, please don't take everything that we say at face value, and don't chuck it away, and then blaming us when you need it in a few years. But what we're going to, we're just going to talk about some of the psychology of why we keep things for a certain period of time and talk about, you know, maybe thinking about things in a slightly different way. And, you know, talk about our experiences, really, aren't we with paperwork.

Ingrid  2:21  
And also, I think I want to add that it's different in every country as well, because we know we have listeners all over the world. Of course, we are based in the UK. So we will give quite a lot of advice on paperwork, or what we think how long we should keep it. But maybe if you're in Holland, or if you're in the United States, or in Canada, or wherever you're listening, double check to make sure that you've got the right paperwork and educate the right thing. So we're here to talk about it. But definitely double check at home. What you want to do with that,

Lesley  2:54  
I think this will also be a really good one for people to put to put in the comments as well and to ask us questions, and then we could maybe give it you know, put a little bit more meat on the bones as it were. And if people have got specific questions. So yeah, let's get started. How long do we keep things? There's so many different categories of paperwork aren't there? And it kind of seems to, and it kind of condenses with a paperless society, doesn't it? But equally it grows and grows and seems to become a little bit more complicated. So what sort of things? Do you think it's important for us to talk about in grid? Well,

Ingrid  3:24  
I think we need to definitely talk about important documents. What are they? And how long do you need to keep them? Because I think for me an important document is a passport and a birth certificate and a marriage certificate if you're married, and I would keep them forever. So I think we definitely can draw a line that is that is that we should keep the for long time, shouldn't we Lesley? Yeah, sure.

Lesley  3:53  
I mean, there's some things that are an absolute no brainer that we know that we need to keep but in terms of categorising things, as an important document, what I would say is if you go through the decluttering process, and it's useful to you, it's an important documents that needs to be kept probably in the same way as everything else. So you know, there's lots of things, insurance certificates, things like that, that don't need to be kept for your whole life. But they do need to be kept somewhere safe for a defined period. And then it needs to be regenerated and you need to swap it over when a new one comes in and so on. So what we're talking about here is that everything is important, but obviously some things are more important than others, I guess in terms of you needing them to sort of continue on with your life or to travel or, or whatever that you know, to rent somewhere. There's different things that you absolutely need and that are no brainers, and many more things that you can make a judgement call over yourself.

Ingrid  4:46  
Okay, so what kind of paperwork? Do you just pop into your head when you think about categorization and keeping it?

Lesley  4:55  
Well, I think the first one that people and there's quite a lot of volume in this as well is bank statements and credit card statements. So now obviously, there's a big move and has been, I mean, you know, working with my clients, there's a big decrease in the amount of people that get paper statements to a tool. Now, I think most people are trying to use apps and go paperless, which is brilliant. And I think we really need to think about that, you know, society is trying to drive us to be paperless. And there's a message in that, you know, that actually, we can be paperless to a large degree with some things. And so it's important to sort to sort of know, and the reason why we can be paperless is that we can get that information from somewhere else. But equally, we need to be technologically capable of finding that information and comfortable with that. So for some people, some people are a little bit more nervous about online banking from a security perspective. And so you know, there's some people that don't use a computer. And so they need to get those bank statements and a payment base. So that's why it's all about where you feel comfortable and what fits in with your lifestyle. So again, there's no hard and fast rules about how long you keep bank statements. But what I will say is, think very carefully about what you do with that information. So if you do get a paper based statement, what do you actually do? Does it just come in and sit in the envelope and never get opened and never get looked at? Or do you painstakingly go through that statements every time it comes in, and tick it off and cross reference everything that you've spent and checks that you've paid it and so on? To make sure I mean, I kind of I do that on an app? I think when I've got an app, and I go into it quite regularly, just to sort of keep a check. I think that if you go into it every couple of days, it's you think, oh, yeah, I did that on Tuesday. And I spent that on what you know. So you can kind of keep a mental check a bit current year, and see if anything looks unusual. And so yeah, so bank statements, you can absolutely go paperless on bank statements, if you want to, because that information is about is available for the seven years from your bank, for most banks. That is Yeah. And credit card statements are normally available for performance. Okay.

Ingrid  6:55  
I think also, you've got now, the crossover between still having paper statements that are much, much older, and the new state is being paperless. And people kind of being unsure what they want. They're still almost still deciding what is the best way. And they're not sure if the crossover was done correctly, you know, you know what I mean? That they want to make sure that everything from the bank in paper is still in the bank. So you, you need maybe some time to investigate a little bit. If what you have online, tells you something, what you have at home, and then you can maybe feel more comfortable and letting your paper statements go. If you can see that they're online, and you can find them.

Lesley  7:40  
Obviously, you mean there's a crossover? Yeah. So you mean, do both at the same time, have a little bit of a sort of crossover period, where you have paperless. And our paperless statement that comes online. Yeah, and the paper one and make sure that you're happy with this sort of transition from one to the other. Yeah, that's a really good idea. And then once you feel comfortable with then you can sort of move forward. I think it's fair to say that most a lot of people don't go don't go back, you know, to do paperwork is a big project, isn't it? You know, it takes a long time. And so many people have just gathered statements along the way. And they may not get them now, but they might have them from 10 years ago, do you not mean, and so I think it's important to to as a project and to sort of work and really think about what to do with that information.

Ingrid  8:22  
Yeah. utility bills, I would love to talk to you about because of course, we've got your gas, your water, your electricity. Maybe your your internet and your TV. That's kind of the things that I see as utility bills.

Lesley  8:39  
Mobile phones, yeah.

Ingrid  8:41  
Yeah. For me a bit of a strange one, which is I see as utility, but isn't really I think it's a Council Tax bill. Okay, so I see it as utility bill, but I find it a bit of an odd one out the rest. I'm much more flexible in letting the paperwork go. But actually fund council tax bills, quite important. So I don't know why. But maybe this is because the council send it to me, I think, oh, and it's only one a for a year or something. Okay, but I think keep five of those or six or seven that feels good. Instead of maybe only keeping one or two.

Lesley  9:14  
I mean, I'm definitely I like to sort of pare things down to the bone a little bit if I can. So I would look at that and say right, there has to be if you're going to keep more than one of them. Actually, the latest one is the only one that's really relevant. It gives you all the information about your bounding on there. It has all of the costumes and so on, you know, it has the information that you need. It's also there as a an id like a lot of people use a council tax statements for an ID. So I wouldn't keep anything other than the current one unless there's been a problem. And you know, in your home whether or not there's a problem with your in your area with council tax banding and things like that, that you can go back and look at, you know, at some point, or where there's something generally a little bit contentious or, you know, there's been some you know, if maybe you've had benefits Pay to council tax. And so it's been a little bit more, not messy but more complicated than the normal. So yeah, pare it down if you can, but you will know whether there's something more complicated than the norm. But always remember, of course, that if you need that council tax information, and you've not got it, that's a simple phone call to the cat to the council to get that and they will resend it out to you.

Ingrid  10:22  
Okay, good point. And like, gas, water, electricity bills. Lesley, how long? Would you say you would keep those?

Lesley  10:30  
I mean, I think, again, we've got we've definitely got a crossover. I mean, the companies that the utility companies are definitely pushing us all to go online and given us financial rewards for doing so. And so I think, certainly most people I work with are at least online for the utility bills. So I think, but if they're not, I think, again, it's about looking at what am I going to do with that information, I think, you know, over the past few years, something that's really helpful has been where they send an annual usage summary out to you, whether that's online or paper based, because that's something that you can then use to, you know, to try and get your bills down, you know, to change provider and swap the bills over. So I tend to keep if it's paper base, I tend to keep the annual usage summary, plus the latest statement,

Ingrid  11:17  
I think it's also really helpful, because then you've got your account number and a phone number you can call. So I would always keep at least one piece of paper, where you can find your number. So you're not relying on your computer to start digging through or trying to log in, and maybe you're looking for something, so have something of a hardcopy, with your customer number. I think that's

Lesley  11:41  
even if you don't keep anything, even if you've not got anything base, because quite often, if you've gone completely online with that company, you won't have anything unless you've printed it off. So I even put, I have little L folders that I use all the time within paperwork. And I just put a sticker on there and say this is the user name for this account. This is who it's where that this is when it started, you know, just so you got an idea, because we tend to change over quite a lot on utilities. Now don't wait, and you kind of forget where you got to and things like that. So yeah, utility bills, don't keep too many, again, unless there's something contentious and some difficulty that you've had with payments in the past. And I would always keep the closing statement when we're a good fit. You know, if you do swap over, maybe keep the closing statement from from your previous provider. Yeah, yeah, good point.

Ingrid  12:25  
Mortgage paperwork, or rental agreements, kind of how stuff if we're continuing kind of on the utility, we're now moved to mortgage paperwork or rental agreements. That's, I think, a pretty important one as well.

Lesley  12:41  
Yeah. And I think people from a mortgage perspective, people really do. They think it's really important and something that they need to keep, actually, I would look at that and say, right, what is that information going to do for you, you absolutely need to keep your deed of mortgage. So yeah, the initial kind of contract that you have with your module mortgage company needs to be kept. I only keep the latest statements for my mortgage, because that's the most up to date version. And that gives you a snapshot of where you are now, if you are somebody that sort of goes over the detail or gets and loves to see where you've gone, you know, if you're somebody that's lucky enough to be able to pay some extra off your mortgage or something like that, a lot of people really want to see the progress they have made. So it depends if you're that kind of person, you know, I am not, and I will look, I just want to know where I'm at where I am today. But you know, so depending on where you are. The other thing that's really important that a lot of people don't know with mortgage statements. And you'll know this, if you applied for a mortgage recently, quite often, a new mortgage provider will ask you for details. And it's only the account numbers and the and the mortgage companies, they'll ask you for the previous mortgages that you've held. So you have to keep those numbers. Not quite sure what they do if you didn't have them. But so I'll always encourage any of my clients or anybody that I'm working with, to, to keep a record of just the number, just the number and the provider.

Ingrid  14:03  
Yeah. And also with rental agreements, I would probably have the current rental agreement, maybe your previous rental agreement, or maybe a letter that you were a good tenants, so you can show that to a future. If you want to rent another house, I think that's kind of really important paperwork to keep, and also rent agreement. It's very clear that exactly who's responsible for Watsa definitely get that signed copy in your in your filing system. That's, I think, very important.

Lesley  14:35  
It's just that it's just having that balance. Isn't it angry between knowing what you don't want to leave yourself on stock and give yourself a lot of hassle if you've got to do something in the future, but equally what you don't want to keep is every single thing that you've ever had, because then the volume is so big that you can't get to what you need to get to so it's about you know, having it in an organised categorise way and knowing actually that bit of information may be useful to me in the future. but not worrying too much about it and knowing what you can get from people and things like that. So yeah, so that's, that's mortgage statements. Okay.

Ingrid  15:09  
Maybe then let's move on to things like insurance. And I'm thinking about home insurance, because we're talking about homes. So maybe home insurance, travel insurance, car insurance.

Lesley  15:21  
Yeah, I mean, there's loads of insurances, realtor's pet insurance. And there's like, any number of insurances that you can get, again, I'm quite sort of draconian in these matters. And think, actually, the insurance that I had last year is almost completely irrelevant, unless, you know, I probably do my price comparison at the time that I've changed over. And so therefore, I mean, this, and this is where I'm at. So I'll just, I'll just keep my current insurance document. I think it's important if you've ever had any issues along the way. So if you've had any claims, or that you have to keep the details. Normally, it will say if you've had any claims within the last five years, so it's important to keep any records of anything contentious really in that five years. That may come up then if you want to reapply for mortgage, sorry, not mortgage, if you want to reapply for another insurance policy. Yeah. Yeah, things like that. Think you know, but other than that, just keep the current copy. Yeah, mortgage insurance document.

Ingrid  16:12  
Okay. Then I was thinking about, okay, that kind of links very good into car paperwork, because we kind of talked about the car insurance limit. But of course, there's more stuff connected to a car, or a motorbike, or maybe you've got a really fancy bike that was expensive. And you need to have. So you probably have several things that involve with cars. Well, as you probably have your your mot paperwork, you're either you're buying or you're leasing of the car, your service, your maintenance. So I was interested, I wanted to think I think, oh, when was the last time I had my tires replaced, and I want to go back and go, Oh, wow, that was three years ago, or two years ago, or five years ago, however long it was. And I can see how the wear and tear is as well as the car. So there's an of course, if your car is newer, you will far less paperwork than when your car is is older. But I think it's something

Lesley  17:06  
very much it depends, doesn't it again, on on how old your car is, you know, whether you've got a service agreement with the garage, things like that. But I think it's really important to keep a full service history if you can. Yeah, that would always be categorised for me. Obviously, the current insurance document the sales paperwork as well. It's important to keep, I always keep the cycle change of owner it says Are you are you are no longer the registered keeper of this vehicle. So it kind of proves just in case anybody says to go around joyriding in your previous car, or I think I that's not my car anymore. And so there's sort of things like that, really. So yeah, there's loads. And the other thing, too, that I think it's probably useful to mention, of course, is you do have to do a bit of diarized in as well because your mot isn't something that they tell you about when it runs out. So you need to put that in your diary to remind yourself to go back and do another mot. So sort of your mot runs out your run away because it's it's piled on, you know, it's under a pile of paperwork. You've paid your insurance, but your insurance is invalid, because you've not got an MOT. So that's where sort of calendar management comes in a little bit with mot as well.

Ingrid  18:12  
Yeah, yeah. Then I thought, when we were talking about paperwork, I thought, Oh, we've we've talked about briefly about bank statements, but we haven't really touched upon children's finances yet. So I've got a little bank account for my children that I keep some paperwork for. So I've got they've got a separate folder with some of their paperwork. So do you keep stuff like that?

Lesley  18:37  
I do. And, you know, I mean, everybody who's listening knows that I've also got a 22 year old and a 20 year old and I still keep some financial stuff, because I kind of want to make sure that it's there. And so yeah, I do keep that because they gather little things along the way. Sometimes don't the little, some people might open, you know, get them a little bond or something for christening, or you know, whatever that might be. So they do gather financial stuff along the way. And then you know, wants to be so yeah, I've got a file for each of my children, basically, for finances. It's not huge. But the kids absolutely are people are some bank statements and probably couldn't care less about what their current balances and whether they've got enough money to go to McDonald's on Saturday. That's about as much as they're worried about but yeah, but yes, and I've got I've got something because that's just evolved. You know, at the end of the day, I've had that since the kids were really little. And some things are in there. And the kids know that it's in the filing cabinet. And they have not got filing cabinets of their own at the moment.

Ingrid  19:34  
Yeah, yeah, I know. The other thing that I keep for my kids in my filing system are their school reports and actually could put their certificates in there too. But I've got a separate separate bookshelf with their certificates, but actually, it could live in my paperwork system as well. But their school reports I also keep together and I can kind of follow up and have a file for that as well. And keep an eye on that. So that doesn't get put some somewhere else, I kind of tried to put all the paperwork together in one place.

Lesley  20:05  
It's an interesting one, isn't it with the school reports? Because it's, you know, we want to keep them. I've kept all my kids school reports all their life, but it's when when does it stop becoming a useful document that you need to refer back to? And when does it become a memory and a sentimental items. So I think after a certain number of years, two or three years, maybe, then they become part of their, of their sentimental box, and then that's the more for them to come back to. But you know, if you again, it depends on what's going on with your child. You know, if you've had issues at school, if there's anything that you want to refer back to, you want to see the progress that they've made, maybe you want to compare one child to another in terms of the progress or where they were at that stage is going to very much determine how you feel about those school reports and what you're going to do with them. But you know, what people do is they'll keep that, you know, when you've got a slip on the back that you've got to send back, we've got an envelope, and we find all those you know, so take that book away, and just keep the actual report, you know, don't keep the you don't need to keep that this is what a five is, and this is what four is. And I don't even know what the things are these days. Yeah, but you know, you don't necessarily need to keep the key because that's just one more piece of paper that you don't need it now that sort of cluttering things up. Yeah, just actually report, I would say,

Ingrid  21:17  
I was actually now you mentioned slips that you need to return back and explanation, actually, something popped into my head, what I find a lot in medical paperwork from my clients, is the explanation how to have to drive to the hospital. And I'm like, they send it with every appointment letter, they send the same thing. And I'm like, I think they know by now. So I don't know, I think it's probably part of their procedure that they have to send it out. But I'm like, I think you know, by now how to get there. So let's get all of the book out. Because medical paperwork is incredibly bulky. And

Lesley  21:55  
I think medical paperwork is a really important one to talk about, actually, because it's going to be very dependent on your, again, on your own circumstances or your family member circumstances. So I've got clients that I work with have got a two drawer filing cabinet just for medical issues, because they've had many issues over the years, and want to full chronological record of what's going on at what, in what year and at what time isn't, they can refer back to it. And so we'll try and categorise it onto the different ailments that they might have. And then you've got other, then you've got other people who have not really got any issues at all. And so it might just be, I can put the whole family into one file that says medical and it's that's fine, you know, too. So I think, again, you know, how you do your medical filing is entirely up to you and depends on where you've come from, and the issues that you've had and how confident you are, that the authorities or the hospital or the doctor or whatever, are keeping your medical records effectively. And that's going to, again, that's going to be dependent, that's going to depend on your own journey with that, isn't it really. And that is something that people need to work out for themselves as to what that medical paperwork looks like.

Ingrid  22:59  
Yeah, I know, because one of our clients is a carer and she actually wants to keep all of her appointment letters, because they apparently the doctors keep constantly asking her when When did you come in for this? So when did you come in for that as she wants to have that log of those appointments. In her paperwork, she finds it really important, while somebody else who might have had a broken arm five years ago, and that was it might not think you know what, everything is fine, it's all healed, I don't need it anymore. And I'm now feel ready to shred this paperwork. I don't need to keep hold of it anymore. So I think it really depends on your own personal situation as well.

Lesley  23:38  
And again, it comes back to this idea of everything being within your comfort zone, you know, so if that's something that's always been a niggle for you along the way, then you're going to feel more nervous about getting rid of things and not keeping things like that it would just have to make sure that we're doing something potentially with that information that we are going to need it and if it doesn't become overwhelming. Yeah. And we've not talked about investments and chairs at the moment.

Ingrid  24:00  
Because I find it I find that paperwork the hardest work let's see, I've been trying to and

Lesley  24:07  
I because you just didn't know in the fact that it exists. So I just motivate me to talk about that. Yes,

Ingrid  24:14  
you talk about it because I just don't know I just find I thinking oh my gosh, it's just so much paperwork and stuff. So of all the paperwork I must say I find investments in shares and pension paperwork for me the hardest the rest of them like oh yeah, I can see this is a water bill and I know what it is and I you know, I know what to do with it. But in all this paperwork for investment and shares and pinches on my car, I know some bulky so for me I find that within paperwork quite hard. So please give me some advice here.

Lesley  24:44  
Oh, this is a tricky one. Now you've put me on the line. I think I think my advice would be if in doubt, keep it for sure. Yeah. Again, you need to take the bulk out of it. Get rid of all the leaflets get rid of all that you know that everything comes in cardboard. Would wallets because all fancy from investment people and so get rid of all that kind of stuff and just just keep the absolute thing that you need. Most of these investments, most of these shares are now online, a lot of people have got a financial advisor who deals with that kind of thing as well. And so you can be reliant, you've got a kind of a third party involved for the most part as well, even if that's somebody at the bank, or whatever, and share certificates. Most people, you know, most of the share providers now do have a share company sorry, have their own little portals that can go on and log on and see what you've got. And I believe that you then don't need the share certificates. But I would always, always, always keep the chests, because because that's your original proof of what you've had. The problem is if you need your share certificates, cash shares, and that if you don't have them, then they'll charge you an admin fee. So it's going to cost you if you've not got them. So be really careful. And I think a lot of these shares, you know, if you've, if you've got a kind of a reinvestment in your shares scheme, and you might get two new shares every six months, instead of taking the dividend, there's another share certificate comes in every six months. And so that's why the volumes are so huge, you know, then you've got shares that have been sold, you've got shares that have changed, it's complex, and it takes you know, to be honest with you, it takes some unravelling, if you don't quite know where you're at, and serve. But sometimes it's worth it because it makes you feel more in control of where you are with the shares. So involves a few phone calls, and I did a I did a job for a client a few years ago, where her husband had bought lots and lots of shares over the year, she had no idea what was going on. Some of them have been sold, some of them been changed. And we unravelled everything and got to a stage where we got back three and a half 1000 pounds in dividends that had not been claimed. So it can be a really useful a useful exercise and shed a lot of shares. So yep, so that was it. So share certificates, you absolutely need to keep dividend statements of account. If you are self employed, you need to keep those or employed actually, you need to keep those as a record because that's income and cost, his income needs to go down on a tax return if you need to make it a tax return every year. So just be Be very mindful of that pension documentation. Again, what you've got the problem with the pension documentation is the names of the pension companies change all the time. Oh, what was this? Is it? What is it now? And so I think again, it's worth investing some time in trying to work out right. Okay, which pension is my current pension? And which is the documentation that I need to keep? But you absolutely do need to keep it. The other thing that I wanted to talk about actually, with that is all these things that we've had over the past few years where people have been suing their financial advisor, we're not suing them, but you're not I mean, they're making claims against their financial advisors like ppi and mis mis selling and that kind of thing. You know, if that's something that you potentially think might happen, it's useful to keep the original any kind of advice, documentation that comes from a financial adviser. But that can be quite meeting. That's all what a lot of information so it depends on. I think, probably well, I say this, but a lot of that's probably gone now, because the financial authorities have got wise to it, haven't they really? So. But yeah, things like that might need to be kept as well. So that's all a bit of doll, but it's not at all because we've got investments and chairs, and that's money. So that's quite nice. But it's complex, isn't it? Yeah, I think it's a little bit scary. And that's the thing, and that's why we tend to keep everything. Um, so but if you've got statements every year from investment for the past 10 years, you don't need those. You just need to know where you're at the moment. Yeah, so that's where you can be brave. If it's just a six monthly statement. Get rid of all the others. Yeah.

Ingrid  28:35  
Okay. All right. Um, you mentioned something, oh, that we need to talk about that as well. You kind of said, you talked about the HMRC and tax and then I thought, oh, HMRC tax and I thought oh, pay slips and people are advised to be 60s. That kind of popped into my, into my head while we're talking. So HMRC paperwork, somebody wants ye supermini to keep everything for seven years. Is that? Is that a myth? Is that true? Do we need to? I mean, I would say ask advice to somebody. And I mean, I'm self employed. So I even want to keep it probably a little bit longer than than seven years. But yeah,

Lesley  29:15  
I mean, you absolutely. I mean, if you're self employed, yeah, actually, you absolutely have to keep everything for seven years. You know, and you need to work out what that what the latest tax year is as well. And so yeah, so that's really important. I think a rule of thumb is if you're employed on pa Ye, then it's four years that you need to keep things for. But again, it's going to be, you know, payslips and P sixes and p 40. fives, it depends on what so people have got lots lips, as you know, there's an online payroll system that people can log into and find that information. So more often than not, I do find myself getting rid of pay slips now for people because they're quite comfortable to get rid of them. And, you know, again, it's like, let me look at my pay slip as it comes in, but I know I can get that information from somewhere else. So I'm going to obviously I'm going to check that I've been paid appropriately this month. But once I've done that, and I'm happy with it, I can then get rid of it, because you can always go back to your payroll department, you know, you can always get that information from them. So, so yeah, don't get too many pictures that the volumes of that can grow and grow and grow as well. And definitely keep p 40. fives and p 60s. Because that gives you then a snapshot of the whole year doesn't have to get this right now, P 45 is the one when you've left employment. So it's really important to keep those as well. But you know, the HMRC the one thing that I will mention, even though they take money out of our pockets, and HMRC are so helpful on you know, their health lines are absolutely brilliant in terms of telling you information, particularly for self employed people, you know, there's loads of information and courses and everything out there. So yeah, really important to know what your personal situation is with HMRC and get that bit right.

Ingrid  30:49  
Yeah. And then I think connected to work. And payslips is also professional development, I think having a file with your professional development and maybe a CV, maybe your letters of recommendation where you've worked, maybe courses that you've done, I think that's all really really helpful as well. You might have want to keep you know, your first aid course that you did 10 years ago, because it's probably outdated. But other professional development certificates and paper is really important to keep. Also if you're thinking about possibly applying for new job or trying to go to a higher level within your company. So you probably want to have some professional development paperwork as well. Maybe even your probably you want to have some sort of if you've done a college or a uni or your kind of your the things that you've got your your How do you call that your diploma? Degree?

Lesley  31:46  
Like she doesn't know the word for it. To help her out now. Yeah, so yeah, I think we do need we do need to make the distinction between professional development certificates and records and courses, you know, you touched briefly there on courses. And so, you know, I literally will go into clients, and they've got the word perfect course from like, 1990. No, we need to not do that. Though, you know, that's, that's a different thing. I think so cause paperwork is very different to professional certificates. And you know, whether you want your ba GA award, you probably didn't have this in Holland did yeah, Bagha awards, you know, grade level for when you were 10, or whatever it is whether or not you want those kinds of things. But yeah, no professional development, development certificates are really important to keep for the reasons that you have mentioned. And also, I'm a bit of a sentimental fool, sometimes really. And so I've kept records of pay rise is not the level of management. You know, like the salary that you got when you first started and then when if you got, you know, a promotion and things like that, I think that's quite sweet to keep and to see, what were you earning back in 9089, or whatever it was. So yeah, things like that. But then that becomes more sentimental than anything else. Really, I guess. So I think we've more or less covered everything. Is there anything that I've missed Ingrid?

Ingrid  33:07  
And the only thing I think maybe that is good to mention is that there should be an employment file where people can maybe their contract with their business with their company, maybe their appraisal forms a kind of paperwork like that. So I think that's maybe one of the last ones I think I mean, you know what we can talk another hour and a half about different paperwork, but I think we've got the main categories discussed now. How about you'd have recovered everything you think?

Lesley  33:39  
I think so. Yeah, I think we've got of course some great things so the most important thing for me is you know to go back to what we started what we talked about right at the beginning is to look at your own individual circumstances and work out what's going to work for you don't be don't get too worried about things I think people have this worrying sign or if I if I lose that I'm going to have real problems and so on but really evaluate that whether it is going to be a catastrophe if you've no longer got it so often that well I have loved talking about paperwork can see I get all excited and you know

Ingrid  34:10  
meet you I actually loved that some

Lesley  34:12  
people there isn't it

Ingrid  34:13  
yeah i know i know i really like paperwork as well I find it's so satisfying to thin out you know all these stacks of paperwork and just to kind of go oh, it's all now orders and it's all small now and it's all invade ordering, I can find stuff back I absolutely love that and I know it's time consuming but I think the reward for having it sorted is really really great. So think it

Lesley  34:45  
allows you to take control back doesn't it you know, out of all things in your house. I think paperwork is the thing because it has an impact on so many other things. You know your job has an impact and things like that but your paperwork I've got an impact on your finances when you you know everything you You know, kind of relationship with your family everything is you know, you know, Mom, I can't find this or that. Oh, God, I don't know where it is where it you know, so you've got all that kind of stuff as well. And that's all about paperwork. Really? Yeah. I really enjoy myself. Yeah,

Ingrid  35:15  
folks braid. So listeners. That's it for this episode. And we hope you've all enjoyed listening and are inspired to take action, and that you are going to look at the paperwork, pile and decide how long you want to keep things and how long you think you need stuff and let some of the stuff go. So thanks for taking the time to listen today. And if you'd like to get more tips and advice, please follow us on social media. And if you don't want to miss the next episode, don't forget to subscribe to the declutter health podcast on iTunes and Stitcher. See you next time.

Outro  35:53  
Thanks for listening to this week's episode of The Declutter Hub Podcast. Check out declutterhub.com For more inspiration, and don't forget to tune in next week.
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